So...what was the point of bringing in Abhinav? - Page 9

Originally posted by: FleetingWishes.

I think you are overrating this just given the amount of time. Your premise is because he knew her past he 'knew' her. My premise is to really really know someone you have to spend day in and day out with someone that Abhinav did for over 7 years. Abhimanyu saw Akshara a certain way -- in fact everything he knew about her was colored through a certain lens. This is where most of the conflict arose in their marriage, either times. Because he expected her to act one way, she acted another, and they hardly ever were able to resolve their conflicts in a just understandable manner. Knowing your partner means being able to create a sort of synergy where you're also able to handle one another, each picking up the slack when the other fails. From the way I look at it, Abhimanyu had built up an image of her in his head based on the information he had and that image came crashing down many times during the period their marriage lasted. Which hardly amounted to anything.

Abhinav on the other hand was able to manage Akshara, intuitively understand and adjust to her needs, handle her stress and her far better. They both had the kind of synergy Abhira lacked which shows in how long the relationships lasted. And like I said somebody who lives with you for 7 years will always 'know' you more than somebody who hasn't. Every single second spent with someone is a second of knowing something about them through the choices they make. It's all active primary information over secondary sources. This is especially the case in a partnership like Abhinav/Akshara's.

I disagree with this wholeheartedly. Abhira knew each other really well, the issue isn't that, the issue is that they are very different people and they disagree on things, which Akshnav mostly didn't cause they are very similar people. Most of the times Abhira have had issues, it isn't that Ak did something Abhi didn't expect her to do, but that she did exactly the thing he was afraid of her doing. The thing he had asked her repeatedly not to do. Whether or not it was fair of him to ask her not to do something or go against her own nature is a very different discussion. But the fact is, that yes, they knew each other, but that does not mean they agreed with each other.

On the other hand Akshnav didn't actually know each other. Nav only knew the traumatized Ak who didn't open up to him for six years. I agree that one can develop a synergy by living with someone for six years. But that is not knowing someone internally. Its not knowing what they like/dislike, what their values are, what their past mistakes are, what their hopes and dreams are etc. To me they were just roommates and that is it. But the good thing for them was that they were both such similar people that they hardly ever clashed in their perspectives.

Biggest example for this is when they are directly compared to Abhira by the show. When Ak lied/hid the truth to Abhi he couldn't handle that and got really really mad - because he values honesty about all and doesn't really see the point of lying, hiding or even waiting to tell the truth in a relationship. But when she did the same with Nav, he was okie with it. Even he hid his feelings and thoughts from her and only told her after a certain point. Both of them were so similar that they understood that hiding things or waiting to tell the truth might be ok. This is a basic difference in what these characters value.

Plus Abhira valued their own opinions and morals over the relationship they had, while Akshnav always kept their relationship above their own values and ideas. The expectations that Ak had with both of them are also very different.

Originally posted by: lagjagale

I disagree with this wholeheartedly. Abhira knew each other really well, the issue isn't that, the issue is that they are very different people and they disagree on things, which Akshnav mostly didn't cause they are very similar people. Most of the times Abhira have had issues, it isn't that Ak did something Abhi didn't expect her to do, but that she did exactly the thing he was afraid of her doing. The thing he had asked her repeatedly not to do. Whether or not it was fair of him to ask her not to do something or go against her own nature is a very different discussion. But the fact is, that yes, they knew each other, but that does not mean they agreed with each other.

On the other hand Akshnav didn't actually know each other. Nav only knew the traumatized Ak who didn't open up to him for six years. I agree that one can develop a synergy by living with someone for six years. But that is not knowing someone internally. Its not knowing what they like/dislike, what their values are, what their past mistakes are, what their hopes and dreams are etc. To me they were just roommates and that is it. But the good thing for them was that they were both such similar people that they hardly ever clashed in their perspectives.

Biggest example for this is when they are directly compared to Abhira by the show. When Ak lied/hid the truth to Abhi he couldn't handle that and got really really mad - because he values honesty about all and doesn't really see the point of lying, hiding or even waiting to tell the truth in a relationship. But when she did the same with Nav, he was okie with it. Even he hid his feelings and thoughts from her and only told her after a certain point. Both of them were so similar that they understood that hiding things or waiting to tell the truth might be ok. This is a basic difference in what these characters value.

Plus Abhira valued their own opinions and morals over the relationship they had, while Akshnav always kept their relationship above their own values and ideas. The expectations that Ak had with both of them are also very different.

I'm sorry I don't get this really weird definition of knowing someone that goes around in tv show discourses because it's as far from reality as anything can be. People aren't static characteristics floating in a body bag. They're pretty dynamic and they change over time. Who you are today won't be who you were 10 years ago. Even core values and ideals change. A person's personality is made up of small details that turn into habits and those habits make up a personality. Knowing certain facets of someone's life doesn't make you know them.

As far as Abhimanyu 'knowing' Akshara is concerned: if he'd really really known her, he would have learned to manage their relationship better because he would have been able to look at and put her intentions above her actions. The period after their marriage was one of adjustment for her. And he should have been the bridge there. In fact he wasn't even intuitively aware of how hard the adjustment was for her or how shocking some of the post marriage moments were for her. I can't even remember much now but one of those fights between him and his 'sir' had rocked her little world. Him calling marriage a mistake had deeply hurt her. She wasn't even the one who'd told Manjiri about Neil's adoption. And the way she was snubbed by people in the house during that time wasn't easy on her. Abhimanyu hadn't handled that entire thing well because once again he'd taken an action in isolation without understanding her or the context. Then he didn't 'know' her when he sent her the divorce papers the first time or the second. You think those issues arose out of moral differences? Wouldn't knowing someone also be about being able to connect action to intention and beliefs? If this was him knowing her, well what good was it anyway.

And I completely disagree with Abhinav not knowing Akshara. Again, to me your entire premise of what knowing someone constitutes is very flawed. Knowing someone is an ongoing effort of wanting to understand them. You don't see an action and tuck it away as right and wrong and declare judgement. That in itself is an assumption that there's only one right way to look at things or do things and it's yours.

Instead, you try and see where they are coming from and whether your own point of view is right or wrong and go from there. Knowing someone is knowing the small choices they make day in and day out and through them knowing their character. It's not knowing their biggest traumas because once you have enough details even the intrinsic motivations start making sense.

Knowing someone intimately is living with them day in day out. It's the hundreds and thousands of small arguments you have, and everything from your toothbrush choices to your budgeting habits. It's very boring very mundane and very real. And let's not discount the fact that both Abhinav and Akshara understood each other's emotional patterns, were able to look at the intentions behind the actions, they 'knew' each other in a way you can only know the other person when you have been in that kind of dependable, trustworthy, reliable and healthy partnership for 6-7 years. Akshara knew who Abhinav was at his core and could have bet her entire life on it and so could have Abhinav. They went through some really hard and stressful times and overcame them together and you don't go through something like that if you're not able to look behind those action sometimes to what's really happening on the inside.

Anybody who's going to actually discount this entire timeline to establish that knowing someone means something else, well then our definitions completely differ, and I think I've already exhausted this topic, so I've nothing more to say on this.

Originally posted by: Krinya

Kyy is my all time favorite & nobody comes close to manik in itv 😆 I just recently removed him from my dp ..I wasn't a part of it while the show aired..I stumbled upon it 4 yrs bk on my friends recommendation...

My association with AY goes way bk to madhubala days ..she may not remember but I do 😆 I guess madhubala and kyy were around the same time..

Initially when the leap started I was fine with abhim ..akshara away from him and he didn't know abt abhir was a big enuf punishment for him..on the top of that he almost married arohi again 😆 Also I call out akshara on not Acknowledging him as the father & not trying to work out co parenting with him..she was def wrong there .. not in the moments where she wascalled out for verbal abuse ..bec those r the moments when I was waiting for someone to tell abhim on his face how wrong he was..and he also called out on her lies.. baat barabar ho gayi..these kind of confrontation scenes bring trps...whether it's akshara talking or abhin or manish , they were badly needed. The narrative was whishy washy that's a given.

I agree to the points you mentioned that NOW abhim is a better version of himself but I didn't see it during the leap..he was under his mother's spell..when his mother confronted akshara he was literally hiding behind her , not admitting his part of the mistake on wd......he didn't even tell anyone how he divorced her in a jiffy and showed her the door , how he didn't take her calls and refuse to hear her ...how abhir was forced in Birla house and it took him to run away to make his father realize something that he should have known already ..he was in back and forth mode and so was akshara ..

As a father yes he very well deserved to know and be a part of his son's life ..I guess it was a given that it wasn't possible with akshara moving on and abhir having to choose one of them..the court sorry , abhir is a minor..only when he gave up on abhirs custody , I felt his redemption truly started & he's now working hard on it .. yes I do appreciate his stance towards akshnav as he was very much accepting to their relationship (except the temple but I'll pass it) , he also tried his best to not cut off akshnav from abhirs life when he got the custody .his relationship with abhin and abhir and ruhi also, was also one of the highlights ..he needs to be credited for that..

Pre leap it was always abhim for me , post leap it was anti abhim , not akshnav..now I can't say 😆 they cud def do better with abhim ..wd bhi chodo , the guy who's so much ynder his mother's spell is chalta phirta red flag for me

Uff I'd forgotten that entire manjiri at goenka house fiasco. YK, it's been so long and overtime you forget so so many details you wonder if you making an argument is even valid🤣 Because no matter what you say, there probably is some detail out there that you haven't seen or forgotten that will render your argument invalid.

I feel like you can't mix the different facets of it all. Like your judgement on Abhimanyu - Akshara's relationship shouldn't color your objective lens of looking at them separately. Or looking at Abhinav-Akshara and their faults shouldn't color your lens when you look at their relationship separately. Har cheez ko alag alag judge karne mein dimaagh ghoom chuka hai tho😆

I like Abhimanyu right now. I like that maturity and theraao in his character right now. I'm not the biggest fan of the pre leap abhira honestly. I really liked them somewhere around the first 2-3 weeks of them but the entire premise was so flimsy given you've met each other for 2-3 days 2-3 days ago and this intense love this intense gussa and expectations are all built upon 3 days of meeting where nothing much was even said. But the premise of insta-love turning into insta-disaster is one I can buy. It's not that the people were bad human beings. It's just they couldn't handle their relationship and hurt each other and themselves inevitably. Although I only fault Akshara for keeping Abhir from Abhimanyu and questioning his fatherhood. Her leaving Abhimanyu and never wanting to look back is wholly justified imo. I want to see how their characters shape up now. It'll be interesting.

Originally posted by: verve

Wonderful thread after so long ❤

Honestly few threads like these can tempt me to come back to forum discussions 😳

It was good & refreshing to read many meaningful posts analyzing the events and narratives as were shown in the show (and not how one wishes to perceive them).

Thank you! This should be the last one. I've forgotten how tiring these IF threads are.🤣

TBH Abhinav was the good for nothing Piyush to the real soul mates Sujal Kashish - Read Abhimanyu and Akshara. The only difference is Piyush’s death sequence was less funnier and much more awaited that Abhinav’s fatichaar type death 😆

Also unlike Akshara, Kashish was an unapologetic biatch who knew she was wrong but still loved running into her Sujal, whereas Akshara behaves like she drinks holy water everyday day and is not dependent on her ex at all while she’d be on the roads or in jail without him.

Honestly in every TV show the third angle is a guy who’s either a loser who dies or a psychopath who dies, itv has no in between unlike they’d pull a Stefan and Damon together, and ohh they actually remade it and still failed.

My favorite unrequited soup lovers were actually Atharva and Vividha, ohh boy the couple was so badass and unapologetic about what honoring the third angle Vividha’s husband, I remember once she just slaps him and says ‘I love my ex boyfriend only and I’ll go to him, you stay away loser’ ohh the woman in me was so happy 🤣

I think after Kashish, Vividha was the saasiest, grey and unapologetic woman who didn’t care about dadi nani swarg and Devi mata stuff, these two literally would honk around their original lovers and treat the third angle as their house maids, truly awesome shows and sadly Akshara maata is written in 2023 where all she needs is hours to change husbands, boyfriends, kid’s fathers or whatever. DKP writers shouldn’t write unrequited love stories, they ain’t capable enough.

Originally posted by: FleetingWishes.

I'm sorry I don't get this really weird definition of knowing someone that goes around in tv show discourses because it's as far from reality as anything can be. People aren't static characteristics floating in a body bag. They're pretty dynamic and they change over time. Who you are today won't be who you were 10 years ago. Even core values and ideals change. A person's personality is made up of small details that turn into habits and those habits make up a personality. Knowing certain facets of someone's life doesn't make you know them.

As far as Abhimanyu 'knowing' Akshara is concerned: if he'd really really known her, he would have learned to manage their relationship better because he would have been able to look at and put her intentions above her actions. The period after their marriage was one of adjustment for her. And he should have been the bridge there. In fact he wasn't even intuitively aware of how hard the adjustment was for her or how shocking some of the post marriage moments were for her. I can't even remember much now but one of those fights between him and his 'sir' had rocked her little world. Him calling marriage a mistake had deeply hurt her. She wasn't even the one who'd told Manjiri about Neil's adoption. And the way she was snubbed by people in the house during that time wasn't easy on her. Abhimanyu hadn't handled that entire thing well because once again he'd taken an action in isolation without understanding her or the context. Then he didn't 'know' her when he sent her the divorce papers the first time or the second. You think those issues arose out of moral differences? Wouldn't knowing someone also be about being able to connect action to intention and beliefs? If this was him knowing her, well what good was it anyway.

And I completely disagree with Abhinav not knowing Akshara. Again, to me your entire premise of what knowing someone constitutes is very flawed. Knowing someone is an ongoing effort of wanting to understand them. You don't see an action and tuck it away as right and wrong and declare judgement. That in itself is an assumption that there's only one right way to look at things or do things and it's yours.

Instead, you try and see where they are coming from and whether your own point of view is right or wrong and go from there. Knowing someone is knowing the small choices they make day in and day out and through them knowing their character. It's not knowing their biggest traumas because once you have enough details even the intrinsic motivations start making sense.

Knowing someone intimately is living with them day in day out. It's the hundreds and thousands of small arguments you have, and everything from your toothbrush choices to your budgeting habits. It's very boring very mundane and very real. And let's not discount the fact that both Abhinav and Akshara understood each other's emotional patterns, were able to look at the intentions behind the actions, they 'knew' each other in a way you can only know the other person when you have been in that kind of dependable, trustworthy, reliable and healthy partnership for 6-7 years. Akshara knew who Abhinav was at his core and could have bet her entire life on it and so could have Abhinav. They went through some really hard and stressful times and overcame them together and you don't go through something like that if you're not able to look behind those action sometimes to what's really happening on the inside.

Anybody who's going to actually discount this entire timeline to establish that knowing someone means something else, well then our definitions completely differ, and I think I've already exhausted this topic, so I've nothing more to say on this.

Let's just agree to disagree then. I don't think my definitions come from itv. I sincerely believe that knowing someone is more than living with them. I agree that living with someone is intimate and gives you information about them. I have had roommates who were really good friends, but that relationship is nothing like a spouse. To that extent I think Abhira also had those intimate living together moments.

Also I interpret Abhi completely differently. He did actually know how hard all of that was for Ak and was actively trying to make things easier where he could. Infact him asking her to stay out of things for a while was that for me. Him trying to shield both her and his family and give them all time to adjust with one another before she started "fixing" things. In this Ak was the one who was behaving weirdly to me, cause she knew Abhi and his relationship with his dad, she knew how Birla house operates, she had all the information. I know living it is different, but I don't think she should have tried to fix things immediately either.

I am not discounting the timeline. I am saying that knowing someone's habits and temperament, does not equal knowing who they are. Knowing someone is deeper than that, and Abhira shared that onscreen really well both before the leap and after.

Eleven pages of discussion on the leap and the complications due to the added character is what Zama got out it.😀

Originally posted by: lagjagale

Let's just agree to disagree then. I don't think my definitions come from itv. I sincerely believe that knowing someone is more than living with them. I agree that living with someone is intimate and gives you information about them. I have had roommates who were really good friends, but that relationship is nothing like a spouse. To that extent I think Abhira also had those intimate living together moments.

Also I interpret Abhi completely differently. He did actually know how hard all of that was for Ak and was actively trying to make things easier where he could. Infact him asking her to stay out of things for a while was that for me. Him trying to shield both her and his family and give them all time to adjust with one another before she started "fixing" things. In this Ak was the one who was behaving weirdly to me, cause she knew Abhi and his relationship with his dad, she knew how Birla house operates, she had all the information. I know living it is different, but I don't think she should have tried to fix things immediately either.

I am not discounting the timeline. I am saying that knowing someone's habits and temperament, does not equal knowing who they are. Knowing someone is deeper than that, and Abhira shared that onscreen really well both before the leap and after.

Yep, we'll have to agree to disagree here. I don't think Akshara and Abhinav were roommates. They were bringing up a child together. The knowing evolved over a long period of time and passed all the tests. They went from strangers to living together to building a strong bond of trust to falling in love and being hypersensitive to each other's emotions and needs and desires. Abhira knew each other for barely 1/8th of that time period and whatever they thought they knew about each other had led to two disastrous ends. So, if that's knowing, they must each be really terrible people in each other's heads. But they're not, because both of them are evolving to see, that their understanding of each other and how they handled certain events was probably flawed? Isn't that how the show's premise working right now? NVM, like I said our definitions and understanding of this is very different so let's end this on that note.

Yes their understanding wasn't there. But knowing someone and understanding them is different and that's what we are disagreeing on. Knowing someone is knowing how they will react in situations and knowing what their values and preferences are. Knowing where their trauma comes from so you can help them through it.

Understanding someone is very different though and they definitely did not understand each other. They thought the other person's priorities and values itself was wrong. And like I said they prioritized their values and opinions over their relationship.

Now Abhi is trying to understand Ak more, but the lack of understanding is still there from Ak's side and that is being shown.

Originally posted by: lagjagale

Yes their understanding wasn't there. But knowing someone and understanding them is different and that's what we are disagreeing on. Knowing someone is knowing how they will react in situations and knowing what their values and preferences are. Knowing where their trauma comes from so you can help them through it.

Understanding someone is very different though and they definitely did not understand each other. They thought the other person's priorities and values itself was wrong. And like I said they prioritized their values and opinions over their relationship.

Now Abhi is trying to understand Ak more, but the lack of understanding is still there from Ak's side and that is being shown.

We need to wait for understanding level from ak side atp she is in her grief and her son not well. She need to first come out of all this. Then slowly she will also realise her mistakes.