YRKKH Issues Thread 2; Admin Note Pg#7; CMs Notes Pg#10 - Page 3

Originally posted by: DevilHere

Suggestions for possible features nd bugs

1) Post Links : The posts links often don't land on the exact posts but on the first post of the page , sometimes creating confusion as to which post was share

2) Private Forums : There should be some monitoring nd reporting mechanism for private forums too if there's already something in place i hope to be guided towards it .

quoting you vijay from the private forums are live thread :

• India Forums Code of Conduct still applies on all forums and also should not be violating any law. We are soon going to revise our COC so that its simpler and uniform across all forums.
• Even though moderation in Private forum will primarily be the task of Creator / Manager of those forum. Our team would be conducting regular checks to prevent misuse of the platform.

When are checks conducted on private forums nd who to approach incase we have doubts that a private forum is breaching IF CoC

 Another quote from your post vijay

Members can report a Private Forum and we will look into it.

By Members do we mean members of the private forum or members of IF in general , if the latter how do we do it

3) Posts Editing and trashing by Mods : Is there a way the post maker is notified whenever his/her post is edited or trashed , maybe like a PM or notification  with a DT note if required like when we report posts. This would help people understand when nd how they're breaching the CoC nd probably decrease repetition too nd make it easier for them to take it up with Mods in PM incase of queries

As we see that there are posts being created in private forums to report posts and I had to stop using GIFs which led to me losing interest in the forum

This kind of ganging up leaves a bad taste in my mouth, no wonder moderators feel enough pressure to remove even GIFs when people are mass reporting and targeting posts in private forums

@Critisiser, @Nutmeg and I enjoy posting memes and GIFs, we do it on every forum, we had to stop posting memes and now GIFs too

Let us use memes and GIFs freely, they are just for fun and there's no intent to hurt anyone 

I'll forever mourn the loss of this Gif, it was such a cute teddy, I don't understand how can anyone be offended by it 

A lot of things were a revelation for me and honestly extremely shocking. Like there actually exists threads where everyone decides to mass report. 

I am not sure which forum is that and who supports who but that fact that there are threads dedicated to mass reporting was something I am still trying to process. 

Okay is that why my gif was reported? But it was innocent. Guess I would never know what is considered innocent or not if that cute teddy was also deleted. Heck! After this I don’t even know what to post in the forum as now every post looks like walking on the eggshells. 

Exactly, we post memes and gifs on EVERY forum. Is it banned is this forum specifically? I hope not 

It’s one thing to see favorite characters being butchered in the show, but it altogether sad to not have discussions or fun banter about the same in YRKKH forum peacefully without someone passive aggressive questioning/insinuating members for their choice of characters and personally insulting their choice. I don’t have examples with screenshots or such, but the decreased fun activities and general forum participation is a good indicator. If Private forums as mentioned above is responsible for this, we can all agree it definitely needs to be looked into. And second, I would like to clarify on the namecalling/swear words list. Quoting a couple of comments that talks about “DARVO shit”, “Oedipus/Electra theories’ , ‘piece of shit’, disagreeing with another member would mean, opposing member would need to go to elementary school..! Some of these Character analysis posts are very triggering, condescending and general retaliatory posts for a bad episode. 
Main forum is really not engaging or encouraging to visit. 

Originally posted by: Ambajee

It’s one thing to see favorite characters being butchered in the show, but it altogether sad to not have discussions or fun banter about the same in YRKKH forum peacefully without someone passive aggressive questioning/insinuating members for their choice of characters and personally insulting their choice. I don’t have examples with screenshots or such, but the decreased fun activities and general forum participation is a good indicator. If Private forums as mentioned above is responsible for this, we can all agree it definitely needs to be looked into. And second, I would like to clarify on the namecalling/swear words list. Quoting a couple of comments that talks about “DARVO shit”, “Oedipus/Electra theories’ , ‘piece of shit’, disagreeing with another member would mean, opposing member would need to go to elementary school..! Some of these Character analysis posts are very triggering, condescending and general retaliatory posts for a bad episode. 
Main forum is really not engaging or encouraging to visit. 

Okay lmao. Last time I checked, DARVO, Oedipus and Electra Complexes were hotly debated psychological constructs. Literally hundreds of academic papers can be found on those. 

Last time I checked they were not noted as derogatory terms in Oxford English Dictionary.

If even then IF logistics team finds them offensive, they can add them to the cuss word filter — edited to clarify that this is a genuine suggestion and not mockery.

Also, just one clarification would be appreciated on whether or not any criticism of a non-existent, fake fictional character on an individual level is considered a de facto attack on its fans who do exist in reality? Unlike hating the character for their social background?

If I say that xyz is a such a drab character for always wearing black would that be same as me saying that I don't think that the character deserves love because they are un-hot/ poor/ speak in a particular dialect/ disabled/ lost a baby/ got remarried — all the social biases that affect the users of this platform?

Furthermore, does me saying that I hate a fictional character for wearing black clothes all the time have transitive properties to be interpreted as hatred for all the real people who like the character?

Is the character = the fans?

Someone's favourite character might do no wrong in someone's eyes while it may be a really reprehensible person in someone else's eyes. Mr. Knightley could do no wrong in my eye while someone else might hate him — again editing to add this just to clarify that I am not immune to this tendency and this wasn't meant to condescend or mock anybody or any fandom.

Bajirao Mastani can be seen as an epic lovestory by some while it may be seen as glorification of an extramarital affair by others. Can people be stopped from disliking and criticising a character simply because a large number of people love it?

Gone With the Wind— a  bonafide beloved American Classic is deemed racist by many African American scholars— many regular people also find Mammy character to be racist. Jungle book is considered a colonialist propaganda by many Indian scholars— again the idea of an Indian kid being raised by animals is highly offensive to some regular people like us too. (Clarifying this because any mention of scholariship is miscontrued as being condescending.)

Something as benign as a Disney cartoons like Scar and Mufasa are  polarising characters in the Lion King fandom. Over analysis and psychoanalysis are part of fandom culture. (https://www.reddit.com/r/unpopularopinion/comments/mufasa_was_the_villain_in_the_lion_king/)

 Are those interpretations to be shunned and punished because a large number of people deem these to be their beloved favourite books/movies/characters?

Certain issue seems to centre around not offending people while real social issues get mocked and platformed as unpopular opinions. If so, clarify if we should not use your platform or visit the forums if we don't like the most popular ship/character etc.

Also, please clarify if this thread was supposed to deal with issues regarding the YRK forum or about how much we do not like people who do not like our fave characters?

Because free speech y'know?

Edit because I forgot to disclose : the questions are genuine queries and not meant to mock, bash, bully,  condescend, moral police any member, character, actor, place, community, people. This did not intend to break any CoC. 

Above post is example of over exhaustive analysis of ITV characters and their imaginary psychological behavior and the condescending tone which is frankly mocking and insulting. This is equal to spamming as it is unrelated to tv material that is being shown which is primarily why entertainment forums exist in the first place. 

Originally posted by: Ambajee

Above post is example of over exhaustive analysis of ITV characters and their imaginary psychological behavior and the condescending tone which is frankly mocking and insulting. This is equal to spamming as it is unrelated to tv material that is being shown which is primarily why entertainment forums exist in the first place. 

I didn't know there was a rulebook to interpret itv just enough. If Comic Con can be held to discuss literal children DC and Marvel comics with discussion panels every year. It is insulting to me as an ITV watcher if the itv shows I love so much are deemed unworthy of intellectual discussion/criticism. I take it as a personal insult.

Again, would appreciate if such a rulebook was also made public in the IF COC if it exists.

Originally posted by: Deltablues

I didn't know there was a rulebook to interpret itv just enough. If Comic Con can be held to discuss literal children DC and Marvel comics with discussion panels every year. It is insulting to me as an ITV watcher if the itv shows I love so much are deemed unworthy of intellectual discussion/criticism. I take it as a personal insult.

Again, would appreciate if such a rulebook was also made public in the IF COC if it exists.

There’s no rulebook to interpret ITV. But one shouldn’t use one’s own interpretation of the show to mock another’s. Because that’s all they are - interpretations - not facts! 

If everyone starts using professional jargon on the forum - doctors could use medical terms, lawyers could keep bringing up acts, IPC sections etc, or counsellors use psychological pattern names and so on- how will people understand one another!

There’s no point left to having a discussion when people cannot understand each other’s terminologies or language! How does steering a discussion so only a handful of those who understand the jargons can participate- making it inclusive or intellectual? 

Also, comics aren’t only for kids. Most participants of comic cons are adults. 

I feel bad for MODS in this forum...

I have been in different forums over the years and saw worst fanwars in BB forums but still it was in control of MODs. The least to talk about yrkkh

Anyway this is my last post on yrkkh forum.....

Vijay & Team , you people are doing good job. Thanks for providing a open place for rational discussions without expecting anything in return. 

All the best!!

Originally posted by: PhoenixRising

There’s no rulebook to interpret ITV. But one shouldn’t use one’s own interpretation of the show to mock another’s. Because that’s all they are - interpretations - not facts! 

If everyone starts using professional jargon on the forum - doctors could use medical terms, lawyers could keep bringing up acts, IPC sections etc, or counsellors use psychological pattern names and so on- how will people understand one another!

There’s no point left to having a discussion when people cannot understand each other’s terminologies or language! How does steering a discussion so only a handful of those who understand the jargons can participate- making it inclusive or intellectual? 

Also, comics aren’t only for kids. Most participants of comic cons are adults. 

Frankly someone finding the character triggering or abusive is not mocking of someone's opinion for loving it. 

 I find Abhimanyu's character abusive and gaslighting. Him saying "mujhse pyaar karti thi par apni behen ki khushi ke liye mujhe chhod diya, mera dil tod diya as a form of gaslighting and DARVO. Was the FL not allowed to leave him if she loved him? Was she obligated to be with him? Then why the accusation? This guilt-tripping was extremely triggering and abusive to me. The show's wrting glorifies abuse and gaslighting including faking suicide to make someone 'accept their feelings.' This is canon and someone is not making this up. The criticism was towards the writing team and not towards the fans or actors or characters.

 Draco is literally loved by half of the HP fandom and called a Nazj by the other half. Similarly, Dumbledore is hailed as the wisest character by half of the fans and called a manipulative  emotional abuser who put three children at risk for the greater good by the other half. People aren't punished for not loving fictional characters lol. Likewise, people don't need a PhD in literature/magic/philosophy/history/psychology to analyze Draco or Dumbledore lol.

Secondly if at all, someone was making things up, how does it matter? It's a non-existent character. The FL literally gets accused of picking up men on roads and getting married to strangers in the YRK forum when she was shown to develop a friendship with her second husband before marrying him in the show. But the point is this thread wasn't meant to discuss the show AT ALL.

"Ur wife is expert in grieving losses. Seedha bus stand ya railway station chali jayegi, apne bache ko bhi train kiya hai.. u don’t have to worry abt them..!"

"And he chose Kasauli wala drink and cliff to give kasauli vibes to sharma ji on his bday!!! 🤣🤣🤣" [what exactly is Kasauli wala drink if anyone could explain it to me, please]

"the only real difference is that Neil's death was heroic, and Abhinav is dying like an alcoholic"

"he got Bhai Ji's family and thought once again, Bhai ji will do all the work but till when can Abhi carry weight of someone's life"

These are literal phrases found on yrk forum that the mods found okay.

Full disclosure:  I find such insinuations triggering and mocking and insulting as well. Does that stop members from writing so? NO. And does it give me a right to discuss about them in a thread not meant to discuss them? BIGGER NO. 

Thirdly, if I only understand Hindi or prefer it to English, can I stop other people from using English and accuse them of being condescending, insulting, mocking and whatnot even if that weren't their intention or even action? Why are members being gatekept for using words lol?

Can I argue that since these shows are Hindi shows, xyz is ruining my experience of the show by using the English language to discuss them?

So again, is there a rulebook that enlists everything one is not supposed to do when discussing itv on IndiaForums?

P.S . I do realise that this thread is meant to discuss issues with the yrk forum and not to criticise members or the show, the quotations in the post are not meant to condescend, bash, mock, bully, or moral police any member but just to illustrate the point that things I find offensive are also allowed in yrk forum if they aren't violating of CoC. I am willing to provide screenshots and links too if asked. I do not wish to hurt anyone — that is strictly not my intention.

Mods are requested to edit them out if found inappropriate. I did not intend to break the CoC or hurt anyone's feeings.

Originally posted by: PhoenixRising

We all have different life stories and experiences. You could be triggered by Abhimanyu. I could be triggered by what Akshara does! But that doesn’t mean that only one of our perspectives is the right or morally just one. 

And even the reasons for coming to the forum could be different for us- maybe you want an intellectual analysis of the show. I just want to have a light hearted chat about the characters and the comically executed tracks! Entertainment could mean different things to both of us. It’s understandable for each of us to support and wish happiness for the character we like or connect with. 

I am not trying to mock someone’s personal history when discussing the show! If I start relating every reel issue with my real life - I will always be triggered! There’s no solution to this in my opinion. There is good and bad in every part of society - no one is good or evil just on the basis of gender, financial status, being orphan etc. 

If someone dislikes a character it doesn’t mean that they are inconsiderate or hurtful towards all women or all orphans or all poor people - and a simple criticism for one specific character is being frequently interpreted as insensitivity towards an entire section of society and then posts are randomly removed/edited because they “triggered” someone! 

If something about the show is upsetting or triggering to someone - it doesn’t make sense in my opinion for them to come and start reading views about it from hundreds of people many of whom may feel differently - and we cannot expect that all of those people would be mindful of our feelings when they don’t know us personally! And by curtailing their speech(if isn’t mocking , abusing or spreading hate for people) - could become stressful and triggering for them as well since it hinders free speech. 

I believe we need a better understanding and guidelines for what is appropriate or inappropriate in discussions - and how to differentiate harmless humor from intentionally hateful content! 

Precisely what I was arguing that criticisms directed towards fictional characters' actions cannot be construed as an attack or mocking, bashing, etc of the fans — especially when done using no social markers. Thanks for agreeing with me. 

Also thanks for agreeing with me that people are not good or bad because of their professions like a driver, jam maker; or for not conforming to gender roles like crying, stay-home husbands, or for their family background like being an orphan. That people's actions are not tied to their social background

Thanks also for agreeing with me that someone coming to the forum for intellectual discussion is as valid as someone coming there for harmless fun. That one cannot be curtailed to please the other.

Also thanks for agreeing with me that posts shouldn't get edited, curtailed, deleted, moved just for using words that might trigger some people but are not hateful. Academics would hardly use words like "DARVO", "Electra Complex", and "Oedipus Complex" in reputed journals if it were hateful. 

Also thanks for agreeing that there are certain things said under the garb of fiction which could constitute hate speech. Say, calling a character "Charger" for example. :)

We agree with each other wholeheartedly. ❤️

We all have different life stories and experiences. You could be triggered by Abhimanyu. I could be triggered by what Akshara does! But that doesn’t mean that only one of our perspectives is the right or morally just one. 

And even the reasons for coming to the forum could be different for us- maybe you want an intellectual analysis of the show. I just want to have a light hearted chat about the characters and the comically executed tracks! Entertainment could mean different things to both of us. It’s understandable for each of us to support and wish happiness for the character we like or connect with. 

I am not trying to mock someone’s personal history when discussing the show! If I start relating every reel issue with my real life - I will always be triggered! There’s no solution to this in my opinion. There is good and bad in every part of society - no one is good or evil just on the basis of gender, financial status, being orphan etc. 

If someone dislikes a character it doesn’t mean that they are inconsiderate or hurtful towards all women or all orphans or all poor people - and a simple criticism for one specific character is being frequently interpreted as insensitivity towards an entire section of society and then posts are randomly removed/edited because they “triggered” someone! 

If something about the show is upsetting or triggering to someone - it doesn’t make sense in my opinion for them to come and start reading views about it from hundreds of people many of whom may feel differently - and we cannot expect that all of those people would be mindful of our feelings when they don’t know us personally! And by curtailing their speech(if isn’t mocking , abusing or spreading hate for people) - could become stressful and triggering for them as well since it hinders free speech. 

I believe we need a better understanding and guidelines for what is appropriate or inappropriate in discussions - and how to differentiate harmless humor from intentionally hateful content!