Does Katrina really have a shady past? - Page 6

Originally posted by: blue-ice.1

Almost there....everyone knows what chutney is...😆..then we have chai-latte....pineapple kabobs....we are on our way...😆

Really? 😆That goes in the Heck, No category for me along with pineapple pizza.

Originally posted by: HearMeRoar

As an NRI myself, I gotta say NRIs have an identity problem, not an appropriation problem.

Yeah, racism is a thing. But things have changed massively in the last 40 plus years since Indians started migrating in great numbers. One of the reasons why the change happened is that other races learned about and accepted different cultures.

It happened with the Irish. It happened with Italians. Slower, but it's happening with East and South Asians. Yeah, the pace is different prob because of skin color and greater differences in culture. But why would you go to a place as a migrant and expect everyone to be instantly accepting of all differences? There will always be a spectrum of reactions. That is just human nature. Those migrating best be prepared to fight it.

The other thing is the lack of effort to fit in. Even 10 years ago, I've seen and heard many Indian uncles and aunties who go on and on and on about Western culture and forbid (unsuccessfully) their kids from socially mingling.

This creates an identity crisis in kids' minds. Indians growing up in India don't have that problem because they know who they are and where they belong. Thanks to the bigotry from both sides, ABCDs end up imagining themselves as a special group which is neither Western nor quite Indian. So when westerners adopt the clothes, music, food, etc, even without disrespect, the reaction is, "hey, don't steal our identity from us."

Sometimes, I also wonder if the objectors realize that when 1-plus billion Indians are quite happy to share their culture, what right do the NRIs--who voluntarily left the country for whatever reasons--have to impose their views on the people who stayed? EDITED TO ADD: There was a Pretentious Movie Review of DDLJ where Kanan and Biswa asked the same thing. Why go on about India when you left the place for money?

One more thing. What is called cultural appropriation used to be called melting pot not too long ago. Keeping cultures side by side and suspicious of each other has another name for it. Divide and rule. The Brits tried it with massive success. Not sure if I want that happening in the U.S.

Cultural appropriation is a dialogue in the Western world and it exists for a reason. That's why I said it doesn't affect people in India. A melting pot can only happen when culture is traded with respect. That is often not the case. Minorities have started recognizing that and won't allow white people to impose themselves and grab aspects that they want without actually respecting the people that those things come from. That colonialist mentality will no longer be accepted.

NRIs don't impose culture on India so I'm not sure what you are talking about. Their concerns are about their home countries, not India. If Indians don't have a problem with a white girl masquerading as an Indian to profit off them, that's up to them. I remember some years ago, Mattel decided to make an Indian Barbie based on a BW actress and it would have been considered a win for inclusivity if it gave little Indian girls a chance to see themselves. And instead, the Indian Barbie was modeled on Katrina Turcotte. Because yes, even when an Indian version is made, it must be the white girl and her beauty standards at the end of the day. Like I said, if Indians are happy with that, more power to them.

I think there is a very deep inferiority complex amongst most of us. The thrill that so many Indians get from white validation is evident to all. The fact that a white person would wear a sari or a kurta or like their movies or eat their food makes them way more happy than it should. There's a reason why those horrible reaction channels made by white people exist like Our Stupid Reactions and why Indians gives millions of views to crappy videos of white people trying out Indian food and all that. See, we're good enough - even the mighty whiteys say so.

Originally posted by: SmittenKitten

I don't think anyone is sure about her lying about her past. It's all just... yes... let me say the word again, SHADY. 😆

Here is a penny..🤣

Originally posted by: HearMeRoar

Really? 😆That goes in the Heck, No category for me along with pineapple pizza.

yes...anything that can be grilled is a kabob...never heard about fruit kabobs??😆

Originally posted by: HearMeRoar

I get why black women would be upset about not being accepted for their bodies before Kim K. But someone has to make the start somewhere. Kim clearly thought it was hot and accepted it. And with acceptance comes imitation.

Anyway, respect is the key in my opinion. I've worn a qipao I got in San Fran to several parties. For me, it was a beautiful dress I got at a price I could afford. Since I'm no one famous, and my Chinese friends understand me well enough, I didn't get accused of any appropriation.

Your friends know you and your intentions, and there is no power imbalance between desis and asians even though we both have a history of racism towards each other. Not that I know of at least.

Basically, racial inequality and the historical underpinnings that still rattle a lot of people today is the reason cultural appropriation is still offensive. Sure, it's great to have more people open up to the idea of mixing things up but it's not possible if the needle isn't moving in terms of racial and cultural equality beyond the superficial. I hope that makes sense.

Yes but then so does people who names comes out on panama papers or are involved in other shady activities

Originally posted by: hotchoco

Cultural appropriation is a dialogue in the Western world and it exists for a reason. That's why I said it doesn't affect people in India. A melting pot can only happen when culture is traded with respect. That is often not the case. Minorities have started recognizing that and won't allow white people to impose themselves and grab aspects that they want without actually respecting the people that those things come from. That colonialist mentality will no longer be accepted.

NRIs don't impose culture on India so I'm not sure what you are talking about. Their concerns are about their home countries, not India. If Indians don't have a problem with a white girl masquerading as an Indian to profit off them, that's up to them. I remember some years ago, Mattel decided to make an Indian Barbie based on a BW actress and it would have been considered a win for inclusivity if it gave little Indian girls a chance to see themselves. And instead, the Indian Barbie was modeled on Katrina Turcotte. Because yes, even when an Indian version is made, it must be the white girl and her beauty standards at the end of the day. Like I said, if Indians are happy with that, more power to them.

I think there is a very deep inferiority complex amongst most of us. The thrill that so many Indians get from white validation is evident to all. The fact that a white person would wear a sari or a kurta or like their movies or eat their food makes them way more happy than it should. There's a reason why those horrible reaction channels made by white people exist like Our Stupid Reactions and why Indians gives millions of views to crappy videos of white people trying out Indian food and all that. See, we're good enough - even the mighty whiteys say so.

Respect matters. But a lot of the recent noise on social media has more been about power than respect. I mean, students demanding universities stop certain ethnic food nights because appropriation? FGS, I used to get Tex-Mex Chinese from a deli run by an Egyptian immigrant in Brooklyn.

The recent behavior just causes more division. And best part is the major chunk of it is driven by rich white liberals. 😆

Originally posted by: blue-ice.1

yes...anything that can be grilled is a kabob...never heard about fruit kabobs??😆

No. 😆 I'll be sure not to try.

Originally posted by: SmittenKitten

Your friends know you and your intentions, and there is no power imbalance between desis and asians even though we both have a history of racism towards each other. Not that I know of at least.

Basically, racial inequality and the historical underpinnings that still rattle a lot of people today is the reason cultural appropriation is still offensive. Sure, it's great to have more people open up to the idea of mixing things up but it's not possible if the needle isn't moving in terms of racial and cultural equality beyond the superficial. I hope that makes sense.

I understand what you're saying. But it doesn't work in real world terms because equality comes from mixing things up. There has hardly ever been acceptance from the outside. So vicious cycle.

Edited to add because Hotchoco mentioned reaction channels. I watch OSR and find them respectful and sensitive. I've come across ones which are clearly not. Lumping them all together means we're not going to accept even respectful adoption until there is equality. So the ones who would've respected would back off and the ones who do not will continue. No progress will be made on any front.

Originally posted by: HearMeRoar

I understand what you're saying. But it doesn't work in real world terms because equality comes from mixing things up. There has hardly ever been acceptance from the outside. So vicious cycle.

Edited to add because Hotchoco mentioned reaction channels. I watch OSR and find them respectful and sensitive. I've come across ones which are clearly not. Lumping them all together means we're not going to accept even respectful adoption until there is equality. So the ones who would've respected would back off and the ones who do not will continue. No progress will be made on any front.

I'm not saying lumping everyone together is cool, everything needs to be assessed on a case by case basis and this debate is definitely resembling a chicken and egg situation. 😆

The problem with the dominant and privileged group (in this case, white people) taking up aspects of minorities and their culture and giving it worldwide recognition and acceptance is yet another way they claim their hold and control on global and pop culture. The outcome might look like it's in favor of the minority group but it takes away from their ownership and shifts their power to the dominant group. It only serves to increase and strengthen the dominant group's power in society and sends the message that us people of color need "white saviors" to lead the way and only then will we be embraced with open arms by others cuz it takes white people's acceptance before others follow suit. It takes away from our ownership and self-sufficiency.... takes away from our power to influence people without the "privileged" group's intervention.

I argue for and against topics in my head all the time and can argue from your side too, so I give up here .... I forget where this topic originated now.