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Posted: 17 years ago

Noori

Noori is a leading name in Pakistan's music industry. Ali Noor (the lead vocalist), Ali Hamza (bassist), and Gumby (the drummer), have been rocking the music scene in Pakistan for many years.

Recently, we met with Noori in Lahore for an exclusive interview.

Both Ali Noor and Ali Hamza are delightful young men, thoroughly cultured and very impressive not just for their musical talent but their attitude, values, and aspirations.

Below is a mish-mash of our conversation with them, sprinkled with some basics on the band. For more information on Noori, please visit www.nooriworld.net and make it a frequent stop, because you will find a lot of released and unreleased material there, in addition to the latest news and upcoming events.


Ali Hamza, Ali Noor, and Gumby

The Birth of Noori...

Noori's music was conceived at a time when adopting music as a profession was quite unthinkable for most people. Getting a "proper education" and doing something "real" was a major social expectation because neither musical education nor musical careers had achieved the kind of social recognition and respect they are getting now. Still, inspired by the way he went through life, Ali Noor had conceived all three albums (two of which are out and one still to come) many years ago.

"There's a personal formative experience that lends a lot of the thematic character to our music. I studied in an almost Urdu Medium school, Crescent Model, which was primarily middle-class. Now things have really changed, but at that time, schools were divided across the Matriculation and Senior Cambridge lines, and Crescent Model was very much like a mainstream middle class private school with good education but no option other than the Pakistani Matriculation system. I was debating going abroad for my studies and decided to do my Senior Cambridge, for which I transferred to another school called Bloomfield Hall. Now that was another extreme. It was a completely different culture and for me, it was a culture-shock. At Crescent Model I used to curse the backwardness of the students, and at Bloomfield Hall I was shocked by the priorities and attitudes of the so-called Senior Cambridge elite. I couldn't reconcile with the reality of the advanced, upper-middle class if you will. They were all engrossed in their own acquired accents and materialistic hedonism. It was the same theme as Peeli Patti and Raja Jani – I felt as though they were all living in their own, very separate world. That's where I first got inspired and decided that I wanted to convey my feelings through music," explains Ali Noor.

Noori's Music…

Noori's music does not belong to any particular genre – they are a self-styled pop act, which inherently allows them to dabble in rock, soft rock, and eastern tunes and rhythms. The most interesting thing about Noori's music is the lyrics. Clearly, Noori's music isn't mainstream pop. It isn't commercial in the real sense of the word.

"Most of the conceptualization was done over seven-eight years. A 3rd album has also been planned out. We used to read a lot of Manto and Ghulam Abbas. We were very inspired by their writing, and a lot of the issues that we feel are quite similar and extensions of the issues that they wrote about." Said Ali Noor about their music. "Our first album was a based on a very simple issue: if you have to achieve anything in life, you've got to learn the hard way and you have to put in a lot of hard work. You have to find efficient and effective ways of putting in intelligent hard work to get somewhere. It was an optimistic album."

The Second Album: Peeli Patti Aur Raja Jani Kee Gol Duniya…

"The second album is an extension of the first album. It's about what happens if you don't work hard," says Ali Noor. "We felt that the reason why you wouldn't work hard is when you become indifferent and insensitive to the requirements of what you do. You start caring less and become unintelligent. And as you become unintelligent, you only try to do things the way they are done normally. You start to blindly follow the norms. That nurtures a very serious indifference, and eventually, you stop caring about the actual dynamics of your existence. This indifference leads to a non-existence, where you end up slowly getting wasted."

"Peeli Patti is a female and Raja Jani is a male. Basically, these are two tobacco brands. We've used their names because they have their own characteristics. They are both too high on life (at the height of indifference and selfishness). As a consequence of that, everything they do and see is from their own perspective. Their world is not round. When they get a very small glimpse of the real world, they realize that actually the world is round. And they are mocked by everyone about their surprise at the world being round. That's when they reflect on the disaster that is their life, and how far removed they are from the real world."

Talking of the one song, Kuttay (dogs), Ali Noor had this to say: "It was actually a song that almost didn't make it to the album. Basically, I (Ali Noor) had composed this piece, very heavy metal. I liked the music and asked Ali Hamza to write some lyrics to go with it. Now, due to the nature of the music, which was really loud, with lots of noise, Ali Hamza decided to write the lyrics in Punjabi. As we know, Punjabi is much better at loud, blunt expression than Urdu or English. It was out on the internet as well and people actually quite liked it. So after much deliberation, and almost not including the song, we finally decided to include it."

The Response to Noori's Music…

Noori has become a huge name with serious fans who don't just want hip swaying, head banging sound, but music which resonates with their own lives. There's nothing lacking in Noori's sound either…their live performances are as thrilling as any other act. Yet, the average Noori fan is likely to have somewhat of a more "sophisticated" taste in music…the kind that goes beyond being able to dance to a tune. And Noori is serious about maintaining that image.

"This [second] album has a certain background. It was released after a hibernating period, following the release of our first album, which was a very big success. We had sort of become inundated with many commercial activities, like media campaigns and all. In a way, we took a break from producing music. So the whole

purpose behind the second album was to sort of rectify the image that we had created, being one of a slightly non-serious, extremely commercial act. It was produced to create respect and critical acclaim amongst our fans and followers. In that way we have been very successful. We have managed to get the right kind of reviews, and we've managed to successfully alter the image that people had formed about Noori, to the kind of image which we want them to have of us. People were quite excited about the release and it's been on the charts for over four or five months now. We still have a lot of promotional work to do, like concerts and media campaigns, which came to a standstill due to the earthquake. But overall, yes, we've got the response we wanted."

Why Ali Noor is called "Tariq Bin Ziyad" by his friends…

Ali Noor and Ali Hamza have recently returned to Lahore from Abbottabad, a city up north of Pindi. They had moved there in a rare, uncharacteristic move for most people their age, let alone celebrities the size of Noori.

"The identification of a problem is the most important thing. We realized that when we became celebrities, got famous, and got a chance to make money. We were living in Karachi which is the hub of everything; I was constantly getting caught up in parties, media events, fashion shows, I don't even remember. I was not getting a chance to focus on my music, reading, and things that I enjoy doing in life. Then I understood what is happening not just to me but a lot of our artists and musicians. There is no further addition or evolution, and because people can get really caught up in these PR activities, they can stagnate."

Having identified the problem with the nature of stardom, came the reflection. "We don't need it. We take out an album, if people like it, great; if not, maybe they'll like the next one. Why should we waste 20-25 days a month in useless activities and not getting anything out of it. The fans don't care about seeing our faces at every event. They want to hear our music and that's what we need to focus on!"

And from the reflection, resulted the band's relocation all the way to Abbottabad. "It took us five minutes to decide that we didn't want to live there [Karachi]. We moved not just to Lahore or Islamabad, but all the way to Abbottabad. Some of my friends call me Tariq-bin-Zyad. But I feel you have to have that ability to burn your boats and do things differently. You have to constantly nurture this sense of serious reflection and a constant check of whether things are going right or not. And if you can't rectify things completely, you can at least take a few steps. Pakistanis are very sensitive people – they can see through the layers of a lot of things. They are not that basic, which makes them the way they are. It's their exclusive nature. So we have this ability to read between the lines but we don't know how to act on it."

Noori Moves Back to Lahore after the Earthquake…

Following the October 8th earthquake, Noori moved back to Lahore. The house they were renting in Abbottabad belonged to a gentleman whose relatives had lost their home in the earthquake. Noori vacated their house and moved back to Lahore as quickly as they had moved to Abbottabad. Speaking of the earthquake, both Ali Noor and Ali Hamza were earnestly distraught. "It's a huge disaster – beyond human scale to understand. People reacted immediately and went to help, support in any way they could. I just hope that it can be sustained. The media stories are going to fade in a few months. But reconstruction is a five year or longer project. I just hope that the energy is not lost by then," says Ali Noor.

Noori hasn't done any concerts or fundraisers throughout the aftermath of the earthquake.

"We have a problem with media, especially people in the celebrity circle, who have utilized this opportunity for self-promotion. We were probably the only celebrities who were living there but as a matter of policy, we stayed completely away from it. Even if we do want

to do something about it, the second that media comes in, it becomes this commercial thing. The celebrities shouldn't become larger than the disaster. The public needs to have its own conscience to help in these situations. If you are not sensitive enough to feel the impact of the disaster yourself then that's really sad and very wrong. We believe in "neki kar darya mein daal." If you do something good, the world does not need to know about it. It's not a systemized thing in Pakistan like in the West, where celebrities have their individual causes and they work to inspire people. There's a missing link when a celebrity is involved with this work – you can't just use the name of the person as a tool."

Noori's Views on Copyrights and Pakistan's Music Industry…

Every musician we have spoken with has confirmed the lack of a copyrights structure in Pakistan. We asked Ali Noor what he felt about it, especially given his legal background. "There is no copyrights structure in Pakistan. Music contracts are not royalty based and we don't make any money from the sale of CDs. It's not an entirely bad thing. Like when we first came out with our music, we didn't have to jump through all the hoops that you'd have to in the West. Over there it's a long process, before somebody actually gets a break, but over here it's all very informal. You can put your songs on the Internet, and the minute you get the buzz going, a record company can sign you up."
But this doesn't mean Noori is lackadaisical about the whole copyrights issue. "The bad thing about not having a copyrights system is that at the end of the day, the artist has to invest back into the art. Right now, the only way people can make money in Pakistan is through concerts. And for successful concerts, you have to have a certain kind of music to make people dance and enjoy the live performance. If one were paid for just taking out music, one could reinvest in making more music. Artists could have a longer life and they could experiment more, instead of turning out the same kind of crowd-pleasing, live concert music again and again. It also gives record labels a justification to invest more in the artist. If they are making money by selling an artist's CDs, they will invest more in the artist. That's how we can shape the music industry to be more versatile and sustainable."

However, both Ali Noor and Ali Hamza (with his Econ background) are less than optimistic about a change in the copyrights landscape any time soon. "We have to realize that it's totally dependent upon how the society functions, and the mentality of the people within it. If people are not used to paying for something then this kind of system cannot survive. I don't think we can do much about it. The only thing we can do is perhaps try to get a deal with an international record label. It's a long shot but we could maybe sign a deal with a foreign company and instead of them paying just us, we could try to get them to invest in copyright protection. It's all about the enforcement of certain policies. One could try it at a personal, private level and see how it goes."

Interesting Facts About Noori

Noori is derived from "noor", meaning light, and hence Noori means "made of light" and also "an object of light." As a play on words goes, it is also a part of the main vocalist, Ali Noor's name.

In a sense, all of Noori's music has been around in Ali Noor's head since he was 15. Noor has conceived a series of three albums, two of which have been released and one is in the works.

Ali Noor's first hit was not a "Noori" song – Manwa Re was sung for a movie and is quite unlike a lot of Noori songs.

Before Noori's first album was released, the band had already become famous – through their songs making it to hundreds of fans via the Internet. Today, the band continues using the Internet for reaching their fans through www.nooriworld.net

Ali Noor is a lawyer by education and has also worked for his grandfather, Raza Kazim (a lawyer of international renown).

Ali Hamza is an economist by education, with a degree from the Lahore University of Management Sciences.

And finally, on Ali Noor's Marriage…

Mandana Zaidi and Ali Noor were married late 2005. "It was very much a love marriage. Basically, it was like we just couldn't marry anyone else, because we had been friends for so long. Mandana has been an integral part of Noori for as long as we can remember. We defied all cultural and social norms, antagonized and frustrated our parents, with our "we are working on this album all night and Mandana is staying over" routine. And truly, we were working. We just really understand each other, we care about the same things, and we'd spent such a huge and significant part of our lives together that there was no question about marrying anyone else. So now it's all official and Mandana continues to look out for Noori's management, marketing, and production."

For more information about Noori's music, their past performances, and upcoming releases, please visit www.nooriworld.net

Edited by wini - 17 years ago
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Posted: 17 years ago

2006: the year that was
Taj Mal and Mughal-e-Azam were released and Ajay came with Omkara. And the only Lollywood effort worth mentioning is Syed Noor's Majajan By Aijaz Gul

As we look back at 2006, it reminds us of missed opportunities, lost goals and failures. But we can flashback still on achievements and a triumph.

43 features came out this year but the only moderately successful film was Majajan, which also happens to be actress Saima's debut venture as producer. The film industry lost one of its biggest assets with the passing away of actor Mohammad Ali. Two Indian films made a miserable theatrical debut here after almost 26 years. And the Karafilm Festival not only brought us respect and distinction but also contributed to the close collaboration in film culture between Pakistan, India and other countries.

The box office and critical record of the film industry was at its very lowest. A total of 43 features (Punjabi 19, Pushto 14, and Urdu 10) were utter disappointment for almost everyone. Saima and Syed Noor's Punjabi film Majajan played extremely well at Lahore, Rawalpindi and Faisalabad. Its business elsewhere was moderate. A film about a married couple where the husband is attracted by a street singer (played by producer Saima) was rather interesting. Syed Noor's direction, Zulfiqar Ali's score and

production values in general were attractive. Shaan and Madiha Shah must also be credited for the only hit of the year. Perhaps Sangeeta was the only woman director in man's macho world who not only survived but also thrived on four box office disasters (Athra, Kangan, Yaar Badmash and Tarap). But then Sangeeta is now more of a macho herself. Her films are loaded with with every kick, trick and brick of action, violence and ample sex. Saima Khan and Laila come in handy for the latter. And if a lack of good scripts happens to be our major setback, Jaffar Arsh can still brag about churning out five scripts in wholesale (all of Sangeeta's wrecks plus Gunahoon Ka Shehar and Zameen Key Khuda).

With the passing away of actor Mohammad Ali, the film industry lost one of its major assets. He was a spokesman of the filmwallahs on every available forum. With debut in Chiragh Jalta Raha in early-sixties, Mohammad Ali soon became not only a household name here but also won respect and distinction. He was the only influential person in the industry who could talk to the Minister, the Chief Minister, the Governor, and the Prime Minister and even the President. There was absolutely nobody else who could do that. Mohammad Ali was not active in films for almost twenty years now and he often complained of the low-grade products the industry was churning out and the mafia which had taken over. But he was always there at his Gulberg residence with hospitality to listen to the problems of the trade and do whatever he could. That is a closed chapter now.

Two Indian films Mughal-e-Azam and Taj Mahal made it to the Pakistani cinemas but did they? The theatrical exhibition of Indian films has not been allowed since 1965. Two films Noor Jehan and Kashish were especially allowed by the then President General Zia-ul-Haq. This time however, the selection of Indian films was unwise to begin with. Most of us had seen Mughal-e-Azam (including the computerized color version on cable, DVD, and VCD). As for Taj Mahal, it was a bad film and there was nothing which could save its career at the box office. And like the Indian audiences, the audience here sank this wreck on the first day, first show. Feroz Khan did not make the sensitive Pakistan-India film matters any better by coming out with his infamous venom against Pakistani society. But we shouldn't take him seriously. He is a debauch who has been slapped by many at Mumbai's late night parties. Feroz Khan is a minor irritant who should not halt the release of Indian films here. Our cinemas need this to happen. They have been reduced from over 700 in 1977 to little over 200 this year. The number of films has been reduced from 111 to 43. The numbers of film studios have come down from 11 in Lahore and Karachi to barely a couple at Lahore. This speaks volumes on the need to make good films and remove restrictions on Indian films. After all, India is the only country in the world besides Pakistan where Urdu is spoken and understood. The release of 450 old Indian films lying with local distributors must be undertaken without delay. Similarly, trade for new films from both sides must begin. It is necessary to let the market set the trend. If there is a market of Punjabi films in India, our films would play and if there is a theatrical market of old or new Indian films here, they would play. As for the fear that the Indian films would damage our film industry, the damage has already been done by the smuggled and uncensored video, DVD and CD channels on cable TV. Indian films are everywhere except where they ought to be – cinemas. If the government is unable to control this menace, then import of Indian films should be allowed without waiting for the remaining cinemas to close down their shutters.

A group of film trade representatives met the Prime Minister to handover a cheque of three million for the earthquake victims, and to inform him of the problems of the film industry. While the Prime Minister has already allowed the film trade to import equipment and machinery with minimum import duty of 5 per cent, it seems that the Government is unaware of the fact that Indian films are being seen uncensored and illegally everywhere in the country.

And now the good news. The 6th Karafilm Festival opened at Mohatta Palace with a dinner and musical programme. Previews/promos for each of the feature, short film and documentary were shown to familiarize the guests on screening. Dr. Ishrat ul Ebad, the Sindh Governor, opened the festival which continued from December 7-17. This was perhaps the only silver lining to 2006. As Hasan Zaidi, the festival director and the real man behind the show pointed out that Kara had grown from a modest film society to a notable international film festival within six years. This is an event where not only distinguished and award winning foreign and especially Indian films are shown but Pakistani films of upcoming and notable filmmakers are exhibited. Hasan Zaidi must be credited for this achievement.

This year's selection included tributes to French director Truffaut, Iranian director Jaffar Panahi and Pakistani director Jamil Dehlavi who is based abroad.

Kara has successfully managed to involve corporates (this year it was Mobilink, Aaj TV and City FM 89) and was able to screen over 170 features, short films and documentaries from 30 countries ranging from India, Iran and Bangladesh to France US, Uk, Canada, Czech Republic, Germany and Spain. This is a feat by itself. Major titles this year included Omkara (Indian version of Othello in a village of Utter Pradesh), The Wind That Shakes the Barley (winner of Silver Bear at Berlin this year), Children of Men, The Road to Guantanamo, Woh Lamhe(based on life of Indian actress Parveen Babi who passed away recently) and Khosla Ka Ghosla among many others. And then there was our hit this year Majajan.

Indian film Nayi Neralu (Shadow of the Dog) by director Girish Kasarvalli won the Best Feature Award with a cash of $3500. The film had won Special Jury Award at Osian's Cinefan festival in Delhi in July this year. Director Girish Kasarvalli is known for adapting literary work. This film too is based on Dr. SLA Bhyrappa's novel. It revolves around social values from three different generations: for the mother, faith is what counts, while for the daughter, it is the living experience and for the granddaughter it is the rational approach and thinking. Indian feature Omkara won the Best Adapted Screenplay Award, along with Best Musical Score and Best Actor (Saif Ali Khan). Khosla Ka Ghosla won the Original Screenplay Award (the film deals with a middle income family and the powerful land mafia against it).

Best Documentary Award went to AFSPA, 1958 (India) and Fuego de Angel (Spain/Peru). Pakistani film Daani by Khalid Ahmed and Farooq Rind won Best Telefilm Award. Best Editing and Cinematography Award went to Road to Guantanamo, which deals with the insulting and humiliating treatment given to prisoners at Gitmo. Best Live-Short film was a tie between Tricko from Czech Republic and Avatar from Spain. Adjustment won the Best Animated Short Film Award. Every win was accompanied with a cash prize. Hasan Zaidi earlier pointed out that cash awards could not be given before due to financial limitations but this year Mobilink was there to pitch in.

A bill board exhibition of cinema decorations was also held on the eve of the festival. Hasan Zaidi said that Kara was all about creating a space for alternate films and film makers. Future goals include a workshop based training film academy, a distribution network for film exhibition by the private sector and a film club. That was 2006.

And now 2007. I bet Kara would now be held in Islamabad and then the Kara in December 2007 at Karachi with more films and more guests. Our favorites Mahesh Bhatt and Anupam Kher would be there to grace the auspicious occasion. 2007 will also mark the release of Shoaib Mansoor's Khuda Key Liye (which should have been released by now but as the saying goes, "Der Aaye, Durast Aye.")

Javed Fazil's Eik Din Lot Key Aoon Ga, filmed and post-produced in Mumbai should also be here soon. Javed Sheikh's Khuley Asman key Nechey, filmed and post-produced in Mumbai is also slated for a 2007 release.

However, these three films cannot change the structure and pattern of the film trade or the habits and lifestyle of once-upon-a-time filmgoers who no go to the cinema but still watch films in the comfort of their homes. The film trade, in order to flourish, should learn to function on professional lines by imposing strict regulations on the members. Self-indulgence in accepting dozen of assignments simultaneously should not be accepted. Our film fraternity must realise that in art and creation, less is more. A single hero and a single heroine working in twelve films, a director directing six film , and a screenwriter dishing out five to six readymade scripts in 2006, is what one calls outrageous excess.

Edited by Fiza_87 - 17 years ago
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Posted: 17 years ago

interview
The other side of Shaan
The gandasa wielding, much macho hero is the only superstar in Lollywood. Yet away from the crass commercialism of his films is a thinking individual intent on breaking new ground in media at large.

By Aamna Haider Isani

Walking into Shaan's home, you're greeted by the unexpected. There's none of the machismo or narcissism one associates with the last superhero of Pakistani cinema. He may have played the thoroughbred, angry male in countless films but none of that is visible in the place he calls home. There are no large self-imposing portraits or framed film awards; you only see a couple of black and white images of his father and then more and more paintings, Van Gogh replicas to be exact. Stacks of books on art and architecture lie around his lounge and the only reference to his macho image are the horse bust sculptures, an equestrian love "that comes from being an Aitchisonian," he says.

hatting with him, one understands why he's so revered; Shaan connects with people. We meet late at night, when his weekly Sunday is over - his mother, brothers and entire family have left - and his wife Amina, wearing a casual tee shirt over a shalwar, is putting their daughter Bahisht to bed as a docile Labrador strolls around.

Even at this hour, Shaan makes it a point to step out and shake hands with my driver who just cannot get over the fact that he is meeting the Shaan. This real life scene makes the national heart throb look even more endearing.

We walk over the freshly dug up garden that he's been working on. His love for gardening goes beyond the fence; he switches on the lights in his daughter's bedroom to reveal an old peepul tree retained within. It's an intriguing picture, especially when associated with an actor better known for his porcupine stiff moustaches and batons. We finally settle down in his lounge and Shaan begins talking about his life today – the films, the ads, the videos and the secret to balancing the life he lives with the world that is Lollywood…

Instep: You've finally finished shooting for Shoaib Mansoor's film Khuda Ke Liye. How was the experience?

Shaan: Shoaib saab does amazing work - he's very particular about what he does. But he's not a simple person to work with and neither am I. Our chemistry went haywire initially – he had problems with trusting me and I couldn't work without that trust. He told me he didn't want a regular Lollywood Shaan, so I asked him whether he would be able to bear the real me? Lollywood only demands my presence, that's it. I call the shots. But when you want me to 'act' and be my true self, don't expect me to shoot at 9 am. I don't function that early. If you want 'me' then you let me be 'me'. For me a film is about deadlines and I can define my character within a day. Shoaib saab is totally different. He's a great guy but I didn't want him to have any miscalculations about my professionalism.

Instep: Why is the film taking so long in the making?

Shaan: The whole episode of Ali Zafar was traumatic. The film almost had to close as after two weeks shooting he said "meri ammi ne kaha hai ke film nahin karni." I mean, can he do that? Is it that simple? But when he didn't want to do it, we had to reshoot. He was playing my younger brother who is now being played by that musician guy – he's a really cool guy – ET, no…EP's vocalist. Jehanzeb…Zeeshan…I don't remember his name. (It's Fawad, Shaan!)


Instep: How can you not remember your co-actor's name?

Shaan: Oh, I only had a few shots with him. But he was a good looking, cool guy. Then there was a huge mix up in my dates as well. Shoaib saab booked the dates with me and then changed them. Initially I couldn't fit it in my next slot but then I did. Everything added to the delays.

Instep: How was the experience of working with Naseeruddin Shah and Iman?

Shaan: I didn't meet Naseer as I didn't have any scenes with him.
Most of my work was in Chicago. I worked with Iman a bit, but what can I say? Models think very highly of themselves. They need to understand that every different kind of work requires a different kind of expertise. They think that by being good models, they're good actresses. Look at what they're doing in dramas.

Instep: So working with a musician and model wasn't that great?

Shaan: I'm saying that you just can't be an actor or a musician or a model. You have to aspire for more. I've never taken acting as the last thing I do. I have politics in my mind. I'm running Fifth Element (his marketing agency), I made two videos for Mobilink – one with Madame Noorjehan's song and the other with Mehdi Hassan for August 14. Sure, do more but at least know what you're doing. With a little training these guys can do much better.

Instep: With directing, producing, making videos and even TV programs, you're also stepping into new territories.

Shaan: In 2006 and it's all about programming. There are 24 more channels coming out and no quality. We're making sitcoms and comedy plays. I've picked up about five professionals from the film industry. Channels are swarming with college students who need to focus. You cannot make foolish plays and think they're funny. They're not. Enough of the rubber bands and the NCA productions, Jutts, Butts, nuts and all that crap. We've already done Jutts and Butts in films – they need to come up with something better. They need to go through the grind. What has entertainment come to? We have a cross dresser on TV taking everyone for a ride. He's asked me to come many times but I refuse to go. I have some rules. I don't want to go and be haggled by some gay guy. Yet people are okay with him.

So I've utilized technicians from the film industry and given them my aesthetics. NCA boys come with an attitude: ghar sey saab ban ke aate hain. Their theses are sold in colleges; it's all fun and games for them. But we have a responsibility. We should not make foolish attempts. To make good programs these boys should come forth with their technical value.

Instep: You mean to say that with technical expertise our films can compete with the world.

Shaan: We have private financers who cannot afford the budget to make a good film. But yes, it's only that. Nothing else.

Instep: Are the storylines not pathetic?

Shaan: No, the technical expertise is the only thing lacking to make a complete circle. It's that one thing that has messed up the entire system. Majajan and Mujhe Chand Chahiye were right moment films. But I lost money on them because the elite never pay. I made more money off Moosa Khan. We have the stories. I've been trying to sell the story of Veronica Decides to Die from the day I read it but no one will touch it. I give them ideas they don't want to touch. We lack the technical finesse because we lack finances. We have the stories.
Instep: You talk about social responsibility and good stories so what do you have to say about films like Moosa Khan?

Shaan: What about Moosa Khan? Look at their films. They are anti Pakistan and that makes them anti Islam. Sure, two wrongs don't make a right but if you throw a stone at my house, I'll throw one at yours. The magic of the anti-Hindu sentiment worked. If the film had aired during times of the India-Pakistan cricket tournaments or the peace process, it would have failed. But it was aired when anti-India sentiments were at a peak.

Instep: What about Hindus living in Pakistan?

Shaan: What about Muslims living in India? What about Gujarat and Babri Mosque?

Instep: So how can films be promoted?

Shaan: Cinemas should be made essential to every locality. A cinema in Gulberg should be as important as the water tank or the police station. Then import films. Get Hollywood, Chinese films, sub title them.

Instep: Taj Mahal was brought in. How do you feel about that?

Shaan: We should not put up Indian films until we have grown enough to be at par with them. Indian films have progressed because of people like Raj Kapoor who used to take free films around to be screened. All Indians should thank him. But no one wants to listen in Pakistan.

Instep: How can Pakistani films create a market for themselves now?

Shaan: When Pushto films recently opened up in Afghanistan and I told all these guys who make Pushto films to take their films for free and make a market for themselves. These idiots didn't listen. The embassies do nothing, absolutely nothing. Our governments make it impossible for the world to access our entertainment. After partition Jalandher TV was kept alive and it served as a great bridge. Now they've made it so difficult with the visas and NOCs. Reshma, Ghulam Ali, even Nusrat Fateh Ali, so many of our stars go and perform privately. The government does not support their profession. They don't allow them to have concerts and this is the only reason why you'll find a million people at a Lata concert but Nusrat performing at a private sitting. Indians are now dubbing their films in Pushto and sending them. We don't have policies. Around seven to eight Pushto films are made a month in Pakistan. They could have generated crores for the industry, but didn't. These people are clueless.

Instep: So what you're saying is that contrary to common belief, cinema hasn't died in Pakistan?

Shaan: Cinema hasn't died. The faculty of getting to the cinema has died. If I can put up a home theatre system that gives me the same, perhaps even better experience, why will I go to the cinema? Good cinema, bad cinema, understand that everything works and everything sells. I still make money out of Lollywood. Why else would I stick around? I've done 30 films this year already. Lifebuoy sells. Lollywood is the Lifebuoy of cinema.

Instep: Then why are cinemas closing down?

Shaan: Cinemas are closing because our production has come from 140 to 30 as there are no financiers. Cinema prices have gone up that's why production has gone down. Naghma cinema sold out to Chevrolet for 15 lakhs a month in rent. The attitude is wrong. Would we sell Minar-e-Pakistan if we got enough money?

Property prices are sky rocketing. Cinemas were built on 20 canal spaces and that land can mint money now. Since everyone wants to make a buck out of real estate and cinema owners are not putting their money in making films, they are shutting them down and selling off the land. Cinema owners should be involved in producing films. That's the business of retail. That's why Chenab Textiles is successfully running Chen One. The same rules apply to films. Cinemas were built over prime space. Cinemas built over land worth 30 lakhs suddenly became a crore per canal. Nobody said no to selling them off. There is no law. You cannot take over parks so why are people taking over cinemas? Look at what Seth Abid did. He took down Auriga Cinema and promised to build another cinema. It's been 30 years and it hasn't been done. These people are just not interested. What will they do with so much money? No one wants to do anything for the people.

I have advised the Pakistan Horticulture Society to take free films from me. Just give me one wall in every park and two security guards to make sure no one steals the speakers – run these films inclusive of ticket price. The big bang theory will not work. It'll happen gradually. It just requires money. They have managed to make high priced localities in Defense out of an area that was a katchi abadi. They can revive cinemas if they want to. But entertainment is so far down on their priority list.

Instep: Don't you think it's justified, since the government is still struggling with core issues like drinking water and food?


Shaan: The common man has absolutely no form of entertainment. He used to have alcohol but even that was taken away from him. The elite is still drinking but for the common man, alcohol has been replaced by drugs and now heroin is the escape for him. First he would have a couple of drinks at night and be sober in the morning. Now, as an addict, he takes his entire family down with him. This is the sort of society we live in. You need to give that man who drives a rickshaw all day some sort of relaxation. How can it be justified to take one form of pleasure away from the common man?

This attitude is why cinema is suffering. If people didn't want to watch films I wouldn't be making money out of them. I want to bring entertainment to the masses and films are the only thing left that come from the top and go to the grass root bottom. There's too much depression, suppression. These films give them two hours of pleasure. They do. These people have no where to be entertained. We have pushed them to a point where they have nothing. Where should they go? We give them films. Now I cannot judge their choice. I can guide them but nothing more. Look at the literacy rate. This is what they enjoy.

At this point a member of his staff wheels in a trolley full of fried goodies, fruit, tea and more. This is Punjabi hospitality at its best: even at 11.30, after having a feast, it is normal to serve and eat as if there's no tomorrow. The servants hover around with hero worship in their eyes, until they are told they need not wait on us. The interview continues as Shaan digs into one potato cutlet after another…

Instep: What do you enjoy? How do you balance between someone who is the face of Lollywood and someone who appears in high budget ads and appreciates Armani suits and Van Gogh paintings?

Shaan: Lollywood is just one thing that I do. I enjoy both films and ads but the force lies in the masses, not the Mobilink ad. I was taken for the ad because of who I am. They didn't have a choice. There is no one else. In films people appreciate me more, love me more, there's more respect. Their hands tremble when they approach me for an autograph. That's the power I enjoy. I am loved by the people. When I go to my friends' places, their servants, maids, maalis and entire staff of hired help showers me with adoration. I'm not paying them to do it. This is love.

Instep: You've been criticized for the way you hosted the Lux Style Awards. What do you say about that?

Shaan: The script was crap. I told them so. I would have wanted a wittier script.

Instep: You also danced on stage for the first time?

Shaan: Yes and it's not something I enjoyed. The dancing wasn't me.

Instep: There have been rumours that you're planning to work on a film in India?

Shaan: I'm not working with any Indian or any other cross border producer unless my government comes up with an agreement. I want to be fully backed up and sponsored; not arriving in India like an orphan. It has to be done on a government level where we exchange information, sign MOUs, have workshops. I will not go alone to work alone. There has to be an exchange of information. I have four scripts lying with me; from Sudhir Mishra, Subhash Ghai and Mahesh Bhatt. I need neither the money nor more fame. Every Pakistani around the world knows me.

Instep: How do you feel about Meera going to India?

Shaan: Meera's always been doing what she wants to do. As part of the industry it's shameful what she's done but she has come far. She is not a dumb person. All the jokes that you here about her are part of the image she wants to project. She's not a dumb bimbo.

Instep: You're such a supporter of cinema then why have you never been part of the Kara Film Festival held every year?

Shaan: I've never been asked to.

Instep: What do you have to say about the Council for Promotion of Sufism?

Shaan: Sufism is how Islam came to Pakistan and it is the true softer side of our religion where one preaches forgiveness as opposed to aag ke badle aag, so its promotion is really good. But again, it needs to be offered to the masses. We already know what Sufism is. The fanatics need to be exposed to it. People who monitor blast bombs and have rallies on Mall Rod. How does this council propose to do that? They've made CDs that'll be circulated amongst the elite. Arre baba, we know what Sufism is. If you want to promote it, promote it through films that go through to the masses. They need to be spreading the message of the simplicity. Sufism is not Abida Parveen or Nusrat Fateh Ali. You can't take it to them through songs; they'll not understand the poetry. They should call in professionals. Till then they're only playing games. They take a dhol walla to Royal Albert and call him saeen. They should do it properly. If you're going to London, take the best and invite the best from India. Most of the talent in India went from here; from Bismillah Khan to Shahrukh Khan.

Instep: Does Khuda ke Liye have a Sufic storyline?

Shaan: No, it's heavily religious. It's about misunderstandings and displaced identities of Pakistanis in Pakistan and in the States. The film is about those people who belong nowhere. The film has no masala but a touch of romance and good songs. But it's half in English and not at all for the grass-root masses

Instep: And when do you think the film will be released?

Shaan: Only God or Shoaib saab can answer that. But according to my calculations it should've been released by now.


Edited by Fiza_87 - 17 years ago
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"I will never stop anyone from fulfilling his religious duties":Shoaib Malik

At 25, with 18 Test and 137 one-day internationals under his belt, Shoaib Malik is the third youngest captain to lead Pakistan in the team's history. But his selection is not altogether a surprise choice for this sensitive position after the team's controversial stint in the West Indies.

He clearly has a good cricket mind and is very clear on what he wants to do with the team. His biggest asset is that he remains one of Pakistan's most improved players in recent months.

In an interview, Malik spoke of the challenges that lie ahead of him and the tragic death of Bob Woolmer during the World Cup.

Q: Captaining Pakistan has never been an easy job for anyone. Even the most respected and experienced players have faced problems on this front.

A: Captaincy is never easy, no matter which team you lead. You carry the aspirations and hopes of a nation. In addition to this, you have to ensure that not only do you perform individually, but that you get the best out of the other players as well, who are all individuals with different backgrounds and personalities. Cricket, at the end of the day, is all about team work.

I have no grand plans on how I will manage this role. But I have been a regular member of the team for the last five years, and I know every player well. I know each player's likes and dislikes and his professional capabilities. Most importantly, I have always got along well with everyone.

I realize, that as captain, I may, at some stage, have to take some tough decisions. But as long as my conscience is clear and the people and board back me up, I can do it. I am not a weak person and I know that if I keep on performing well, it will become easier for me to get things done my way.

The death of my father last year has also made me a more mature person. With responsibility, one tends to change for the better and have a more positive and mature outlook towards life.

Q: There are a lot of allegations and perhaps misconceptions about the team environment and culture, specifically the talk about Inzamam-ul-Haq making the players ultra-religious and him holding too much power. What is your take on these allegations?

A: As far as religion is concerned, we are all Muslims and we pray five times a day. I will never try to stop anyone from fulfilling his religious duties or beliefs. My main desire is for each player to perform to the best of his capabilities, because that is what he has been selected to do in the national team. Inzamam never forced anyone to say prayers or take part in religious activities; the players who wanted to do it did it as part of their belief. But yes, it is now part of our culture in the team to pray together whenever possible.

After the disappointment of the World Cup, people are trying to find excuses and reasons for the debacle. But people have forgotten that under Inzamam, the team enjoyed a lot of success. If we fared poorly in the World Cup, it was only because we just didn't click and didn't get enough time to regroup. We basically have always been a side that can come back from the dead. But in the World Cup everything happened so quickly that it left everyone shattered. And don't forget, the absence of Shoaib Akhtar and Mohammad Asif had a big bearing on us. They would have made a big difference to us in both the matches we lost on pitches that assisted the bowlers.

Q: Inzamam says he wants to continue playing Test cricket. As captain, what do you have to say about this?

A: Inzamam is a great player and one of the best batsmen in the world. However, selection of all players will now be gauged on the basis of their form and fitness. But personally, I feel it will be a long time before we can find someone of the calibre of Inzamam.

Q: There is a history of players leading revolts against junior captains. Javed Miandad and Wasim Akram, for example, both faced this situation. Does this bit of history concern you?

A: I really don't know the background of those incidents. But one thing I do know is that there is a lot of unity in this team, and if some senior or junior player has a disagreement with me or with my methods, he can discuss it with me, and we can sort things out. That is the sort of thing that Inzamam and our coach, Bob Woolmer, promoted. So that is not going to change. I always believe that when the lines of communication are open, disagreement and divisive issues do not take permanent root. I am still young, and I will be leaning on the seniors to guide me and back me up.

Q: What are your short- and long-term goals as captain?

A: The board has appointed me till the end of the year, and in this period we have three important assignments. The Twenty20 World Cup in South Africa, the South African Test tour of Pakistan, and then we go to India for a full series in November. My immediate aim is that we do well in these assignments to regain the confidence of the people and put the team back on a winning track. The long-term goal, obviously, is the next World Cup, and I believe we have the talent to create a strong one-day outfit. But I would certainly like to push for more consistency when it comes to the selection of players. We need to find a reliable opening pair immediately.

Q: It is said that you were the blue-eyed boy of Bob Woolmer and he had singled you out as captain material. How much has his death affected you as a person?

A: The entire team is distraught with his death. He was more than our coach. He got along well with everyone and was very friendly and comfortable to work with. When you lose such a person, you feel a big void, and it takes time to fill it. Woolmer helped me and always pushed me to play beyond a point that I never thought I was capable of. I would have loved to work with him as captain. But now we just have to move on, and I am sure we will have a similar relationship with our new coach, whoever he is.


Edited by kalli - 17 years ago
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Posted: 17 years ago

Reema : I Believe in good work

Date: 2007-05-19

A good news for cinema-lovers, yet I am not one of them, but still I'll love to let you people know about the upcoming ventures of Reema Khan. I guess it is enough information about the Lollywood icon Reema. She started her career with her superhit debut movie Bulandi with one and only Shaan. Her debut production was Koi tujh sa kahan, the only flick that led me to the cinema. I must be thankful to Reema, because her production was the only factor that forced me to visit a cinema for the very first time. I don't want to assess her work right now. You can better understand the 'reason'.

While responding to a question, Reema said, "I am very eager to start the production of my film. Filmmakers are the only source who can assure a good budget film that will certainly give the desired output." She added, "Multinational companies must conduct standard award shows, like Lux Style awards, it would be a fruitful contribution to the film industry. India has developed its film industry with the support of such healthy promotional activities."

But I am still wondering what sort of style our Lollywood will promote in these award shows. Anyway.

Reema said, "Whatever I do, I believe in quality. Not only quality but also facts! What I do, I try to do it well, whether it is an ad or a flick."

That's what professionalism is!

Responding to a question about her wedding plans, Reema said, "I am waiting for the right one and the right time. God knows better."

"I had a crush on someone, but…. Past is past. He was not meant for me. That's what we call luck," she added.

While asked about her plans to work in Bollywood, she said, "I believe in quality and standard, whenever I get it, I won't hesitate working across the borders."

Talking about Syed Noor and Saima's wedding, Reema said, "It is their personal matter, but still it isn't a bad thing. Syed Noor should have disclosed it before their wedding, that would have been better."

Reema said, "Bollywood flicks should be shown in Pakistani cinemas. I was not very much in favour of Indian movies here in Pakistan, but the scenario is different, we must be liberal to learn from others." She added, "We must change our behaviour and avoid making those old and typical movies, which only shows the negativity and maar dhaar stuff."

I wish Reema would be able to come up with a good one in her new venture. So that we all might be able to see her in the next Cannes Festival with her lucky one just like Abhi-Ash.

Edited by kalli - 17 years ago
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Posted: 17 years ago

Shahzad Roy teams up with Abida Parveen : JUST IN

Shazhad Roy seems to have a knack for working on projects that create somewhat of a bang. His latest offering comes in the form of a musical collaboration between him and queen of Sufi soul, Abida Parveen, rooted on his latest venture — Equality in Education.

Talking exclusively to Images, Roy spoke about how he approached Abida for lending her vocals to the song after he had composed the music for it. When it first begins, the song seems to be somewhat of an instrumental with soft guitar riffs that build up momentum gradually, however, not too much. Shahzad Roy isn't the primary vocalist, leaving that to Abida, and prefers to sing only the title throughout the composition: Aao de dein inhain zindagi (Let's give them life).

Abida apa, as Shahzad is prone to calling her, listened to the composition and consented to sing for the song. Previously before this, she has never collaborated with any other musician on any project and this is also her first proper music video to date. The introduction of her vocals comes as a burst of energy into Aao De Dein Inhain Zindagi and the overall effect may be considered to be somewhat brilliant. According to Roy, she's added an amazing spiritual element to the song.

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The introduction of Abida Parveen's vocals comes as a burst of energy into 'Aao De Dein Inhain Zindagi' and the overall effect may be considered to be somewhat brilliant. According to Shahzad Roy, she's added an amazing spiritual element to the song

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He also spoke about a conversation between him and Bryan Adams during the latter's last visit to Pakistan, in which Adams pointed out that one need not look for inspiration elsewhere when it came to material for music, as there was so much to write and sing about right here.

Directed by Sohaib, the Aao De Dein Inhain Zindagi video is simply done with Roy in front of a chalk board and Abida somewhere near him, in other frames books, children and an abacus also make their appearance in the midst of text scrolling across the screen with messages in them. The video is expected to be released on the airwaves shortly.

But this is not the only thing that Shahzad Roy has up his sleeve as according to him the heir to the English throne, Prince Charles, has offered to send representatives from the Volunteer Service Overseas (VSO) to help train teachers working for Zindagi Trust as well. A workable plan is being formulated currently to help get this in process. Also joining in the ZT team is Sami Mustafa, the principle of the Centre of Advanced Studies (CAS) in Karachi. Roy acknowledges his contribution and is pretty excited about having him on board.

Shahzad speaks very strongly about education and how it can help to not only change a person's life but also their overall civic sense. At the end of it all, it can be said that he not only has the vision but also the focus, determination and most importantly, the heart, to try and realise it. And this, his latest collaboration with Abida Parveen might just be a little peek into how he plans to go about it.

Edited by kalli - 17 years ago
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Posted: 17 years ago


From reel to real life
By Shoaib Ahmed

The film fraternity had long since had a fairly good idea about the liking the two Lollywood lovelies had developed for each other. But no one was expecting that their hush-hush marriage would explode like a bomb.

The news that Saima and Syed Noor have tied the knot shocked the general public more than the film circles, who believed that like all other scandals in the film industry, this one, too, would fizzle out with time. The news packed an added punch for the fans of Syed Noor because the latter was on record for having constantly and vehemently denied any relations with Saima, adding that she is "just a colleague." For them, what made the news even more indigestible was that their beloved Shahji was already married to writer-journalist Rukhsana Noor.

No sooner did the news of the Noor-Saima marriage run on television, it spread like the proverbial wild fire. Interestingly, both Rukhsana and Shahji have common friends in the film industry, so the reaction from them was also a mixed one. Some remained tightlipped while others preferred not to comment. The more optimistic among them distributed sweets in the studios.

A few days ago, I managed to grab an opportunity to have a candid chat with Saima who said, "A marriage moves on the wheels of love and ours is not a 'commitment marriage' as termed by some jealous quarters."

Obviously overjoyed, she added, "Shahji and I got married two years ago on July 24, 2005, but I think this is the right time to disclose it. For the last many days I was mustering up the courage to tell the world that I am a married woman now and the wife of Syed Noor, in whom I have found a wonderful husband."

As to what made her publicly announce the marriage, Saima said, "I haven't announced my marriage to Shahji due to any pressures and neither am I in the family way. I repeat that I thought this was the right time to tell people about it."As a woman, has she given any thought to Shahji's first wife, Rukhsana, and how she must feel after the disclosure? "Rukhsana knew about it when the marriage took place in 2005," disclosed Saima. Keeping Syed Noor's Casanova image in mind that has stuck to him over the years, I ask Saima if she has any doubts about his affections towards her. "I can assure you that he will never betray me. He loves me and our marriage will weather any storms."

To my query that according to certain rumours, the couple got married not two but five years ago in Islamabad at a ceremony in which some film personalities were also invited, Saima denies any such happening. "But we will soon hold our valima in Lahore," she adds.

The reason behind the disclosure on Saima's part is monetary. Sources say the production of 'Majajan' was financed by her but at the end of the day she got nothing out of the earnings. This led to a cold war between the couple and Saima announced the marriage. Ironically, the film stars Shaan inthe central character that many say personifies Syed Noor

Saima says that her course of action as a married actress would be to stay in the film industry and do selective work, with frequent appearances in television plays. "I have some good offers from television," she said.

When approached for her comments, Syed Noor's first wife, Rukhsana Noor, said that her reaction to the marriage was "nothing" and "no comments". I repeated Saima's earlier statement according to which she (Rukhsana) knew about the marriage at the time it was solemised. "It's all disinformation. I came to know about it only when the private TV channel recently aired the news."

What course of action will she take? "Whatever I do is a personal matter that I don't want to share with the Press. The marriage has taken place. What I will do is save Noor and get him out of trouble."

According to close circles, Saima and Shahji developed a liking for each other on the sets of the film Ghoonghat. Noor was the director and Shehzad Rafique the producer.

Syed Noor was not available for comments as he was in London till the filing of this report.

Filmstar Saima first started acting in Punjabi films as a replacement for popular actresses such as Anjuman, the late Nadira, Gori and Neeli who gradually left the industry. After Nadira's cold-blooded murder, Saima began to appear as the female lead opposite the late Sultan Rahi in Punjabi films. It was Syed Noor who introduced her to Urdu films and made her a bankable star with films such as Choorian and Majajan.

Those close to Syed Noor say that even Shahji did not know that Saima out would announce their marriage to the media in such a dramatic fashion. He was in Karachi at that time and after the news broke out, he switched off his cell phone to avoid any calls. It was only the next day that he confirmed the news of his marriage to Saima via the Press.

The reason behind the disclosure on Saima's part is monetary. Sources say the production of Majajan was financed by Saima but at the end of the day she got nothing out of the earnings. This led to a cold war between the couple and Saima announced the marriage. The couple was allegedly having clashes over financial matter for the past many months. However, when Saima was approached with the query, she denied it altogether. Ironically, Majajan stars Shaan in the central character that may say personifies Syed Noor, with some real-life inspired twists and turns.

The same sources also revealed that Syed Noor had plans to exhibit Majajan in London along with Saima, but now he has left for the destination alone.
Edited by Fiza_87 - 17 years ago
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Posted: 17 years ago
Something more than music
By Madeeha Syed

Shazhad Roy seems to have a knack for working on projects that create somewhat of a bang. His latest offering comes in the form of a musical collaboration between him and queen of Sufi soul, Abida Parveen, rooted on his latest venture — Equality in Education.

Talking exclusively to Images, Roy spoke about how he approached Abida for lending her vocals to the song after he had composed the music for it. When it first begins, the song seems to be somewhat of an instrumental with soft guitar riffs that build up momentum gradually, however, not too much. Shahzad Roy isn't the primary vocalist, leaving that to Abida, and prefers to sing only the title throughout the composition: Aao de dein inhain zindagi (Let's give them life).

Abida apa, as Shahzad is prone to calling her, listened to the composition and consented to sing for the song. Previously before this, she has never collaborated with any other musician on any project and this is also her first proper music video to date. The introduction of her vocals comes as a burst of energy into Aao De Dein Inhain Zindagi and the overall effect may be considered to be somewhat brilliant. According to Roy, she's added an amazing spiritual element to the song.

The introduction of Abida Parveen's vocals comes as a burst of energy into 'Aao De Dein Inhain Zindagi' and the overall effect may be considered to be somewhat brilliant. According to Shahzad Roy, she's added an amazing spiritual element to the song

He also spoke about a conversation between him and Bryan Adams during the latter's last visit to Pakistan, in which Adams pointed out that one need not look for inspiration elsewhere when it came to material for music, as there was so much to write and sing about right here.

Directed by Sohaib, the Aao De Dein Inhain Zindagi video is simply done with Roy in front of a chalk board and Abida somewhere near him, in other frames books, children and an abacus also make their appearance in the midst of text scrolling across the screen with messages in them. The video is expected to be released on the airwaves shortly.

But this is not the only thing that Shahzad Roy has up his sleeve as according to him the heir to the English throne, Prince Charles, has offered to send representatives from the Volunteer Service Overseas (VSO) to help train teachers working for Zindagi Trust as well. A workable plan is being formulated currently to help get this in process. Also joining in the ZT team is Sami Mustafa, the principle of the Centre of Advanced Studies (CAS) in Karachi. Roy acknowledges his contribution and is pretty excited about having him on board.

Shahzad speaks very strongly about education and how it can help to not only change a person's life but also their overall civic sense. At the end of it all, it can be said that he not only has the vision but also the focus, determination and most importantly, the heart, to try and realise it. And this, his latest collaboration with Abida Parveen might just be a little peek into how he plans to go about it.
Edited by Fiza_87 - 17 years ago
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