Theme of the Week - Semi classical songs - Page 3

What richness! I am going to copy these song lists onto Notepad and listen to them over the coming weeks. And Keerti (and others), thank you for the music theory links.

Nice site on classical music:

http://www.itcsra.org/

Since this thread is related to classical music, I have a question regarding some elements of classical music. What is the exact difference between murki and taan? Is it based on the number of notes sung in sequence? In the above site, its said that murki is like a short, subtle taan. But what determines which one is which? How can tell you when you're listening?

Maybe I am thinking too much 😆 but its something I've been wondering about...😊

What I have often thought would be useful to me is a glossary that goes from Carnatic to Hindustani to Western classical terms as applicable. Not sharing a musical vocabulary is a huge impediment to discussing music.

If someone can define murki and taan, etc. for Sonya, I will try and come up with Carnatic equivalents. I kind of know what they are, but it would be neat to be sure.

sonya, i was waiting for someone to reply to your query and then i saw that vanaja has replied and i was like cool!! 😆

anyways i'll try ... a murki is a subset of a taan ... it is a specialised form of taan where you start with a note and use both the upper and lower note following it and kind of oscillate between them ...
i'll take the example of bhoopali or mohanam in carnatic classical ...
aaroha - S R G P D S
avaroha - S D P G R S
a common murki would be G P D P, G R S R, S D' S

D' - indicates the lower scale for D

murkis are more commonly used in thumri singing in between verses ...

a taan is longer and uses any or all notes in the raga and is sung fast ... taans are a common fixture of classical singing and are used in all forms of khayal gayaki normally towards the end as it picks up speed and reaches a crescendo towards finish.

with Bhoopali again - a taan set on teen tal

GP DP GR GG | PD DP GR GR | PG DP GR SR | GR SR SD' S, |

hope i made sense 😳

kirti..it looks like greek latin and sanskrit to me. 😳 .kaash maine seekha hota...

Wow - that indeed sounds so fascinating. 👏 .. Like Ankita, I also wish that I had learnt classical music

Ok, Keerti, let me take it from there and see what I can do. Now if there are real ustaads reading my efforts and laughing, I say to you, come show us what we don't know!

In Carnatic music, you would call a murki a gamakam. The free form components of the performance of a composition (kriti or keertanam to a North Indian bandish) would typically be as follows:

Ragam-Taanam-Pallavi

Alaapanai (Alaap)
Taanam (Nom-tom in Hindustani)

The Pallavi is the mukhda of the bandish, and the Anupallavi the antara. (Btw, it took me a long time to figure this out and I did it from Antakshari!) We also have a last part where most of the flourishes happen--the Charanam.

Every line of the Pallavi and Anupallavi are repeated several times with increasing murkis or gamakams. Each such repetition is a Sangadi (where the 'd' is like 'd' in Damodar) or a Neraval. All the gamakams have to be consistent with the raga, and ALL of them have to start and end with precision within the structure of a taalam. This is why taalam is such an inalienable part of the way Carnatic singers learn to sing.

In the Charanam too, each line is sung with variations, but this is the place where the singer usually shows off her virtuosity. In the Charanam, sangadis are called Neravals. They play with sahityam (lyrics) and swaram (notes) to sing different neravals, to break the line and sing a string of notes (kalpanaswaram, because these are all improvised) that again HAVE to end at the prescribed point in the rhythm cycle and approach the note where they continue the song again in a manner consistent with the raagam. In other words, in the Charanam, the sangadis yield to the Kalpanaswaram.

In contemporary concerts, when the Ragam-Tanam-Pallavi is performed, there is a space given for 'Tani aavartanam' or solo performances by the accompanying instrumentalists.

The ability to sing controlled murkis or gamakams, controlled both by raga and by taalam, is a key measure of ability in Carnatic music.

This is a very conversational intro written by someone whose learning is through osmosis and so likely to be faulty.

Some online resources prepared by experts:

http://www.carnatica.net/

http://www.indianetzone.com/2/carnatic_music.htm

http://www.rhythmnraga.org/carnaticmusic2.html

If you want to listen to good Carnatic music, try starting with something like
this album by Bombay Jayashree http://www.musicindiaonline.com/music/carnatic_vocal/s/album .6188/
or
this concert album by Aruna Sayeeram
http://www.musicindiaonline.com/music/carnatic_vocal/s/album .2307/artist.110/

I hope this helps and I hope if there are mistakes, someone corrects them.

Originally posted by: kiti_g

sonya, i was waiting for someone to reply to your query and then i saw that vanaja has replied and i was like cool!! 😆

anyways i'll try ... a murki is a subset of a taan ... it is a specialised form of taan where you start with a note and use both the upper and lower note following it and kind of oscillate between them ...
i'll take the example of bhoopali or mohanam in carnatic classical ...
aaroha - S R G P D S
avaroha - S D P G R S
a common murki would be G P D P, G R S R, S D' S

D' - indicates the lower scale for D

murkis are more commonly used in thumri singing in between verses ...

a taan is longer and uses any or all notes in the raga and is sung fast ... taans are a common fixture of classical singing and are used in all forms of khayal gayaki normally towards the end as it picks up speed and reaches a crescendo towards finish.

with Bhoopali again - a taan set on teen tal

GP DP GR GG | PD DP GR GR | PG DP GR SR | GR SR SD' S, |

hope i made sense 😳

Thanks for the detailed explanation. 😊
I never knew Raag bhopali didn't have Ma. I wonder why its excluded. So many raags and variations and elements! So raags in Carnatic music have different names. Bhoopali=Mohanam. Both are exactly the same, right?

Raag Bhoopali performance from former SRGM contestant Vijay Prakash. Performance puts you in a trance.
I think he sang in Cheemi Kum recently.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=ENZ1QLE66z0

After reading the explanation, the murki seems to have more restrictions (upper and lower note part) than a taan.

Does the taan always have to reach a crescendo though? Could it be decrescendo instead?

Usually when I think of taan, I think of notes sung faster than usual, either two notes sung fast together. I think it can be either three or four notes too for expert singers. Maybe more?

This is from a piece I've learned. Just learning for fun and interest.
I think its raag Bageshree, teen tal:

S R g M P D n or (S R G M P D N)
Ga and Ni are Komal.

(I can't put a dot so will indicate the higher scale with blue)

S n D M D n S | g M g R S N S


P.S. It doesn't look like we'll have the theme this week. Maybe next week. I don't mind the past themes but for variety, they should have a semi classical theme. Let's see.

Originally posted by: vanajaakshi

Ok, Keerti, let me take it from there and see what I can do. Now if there are real ustaads reading my efforts and laughing, I say to you, come show us what we don't know!

In Carnatic music, you would call a murki a gamakam. The free form components of the performance of a composition (kriti or keertanam to a North Indian bandish) would typically be as follows:

Ragam-Taanam-Pallavi

Alaapanai (Alaap)
Taanam (Nom-tom in Hindustani)

The Pallavi is the mukhda of the bandish, and the Anupallavi the antara. (Btw, it took me a long time to figure this out and I did it from Antakshari!) We also have a last part where most of the flourishes happen--the Charanam.

Every line of the Pallavi and Anupallavi are repeated several times with increasing murkis or gamakams. Each such repetition is a Sangadi (where the 'd' is like 'd' in Damodar) or a Neraval. All the gamakams have to be consistent with the raga, and ALL of them have to start and end with precision within the structure of a taalam. This is why taalam is such an inalienable part of the way Carnatic singers learn to sing.

In the Charanam too, each line is sung with variations, but this is the place where the singer usually shows off her virtuosity. In the Charanam, sangadis are called Neravals. They play with sahityam (lyrics) and swaram (notes) to sing different neravals, to break the line and sing a string of notes (kalpanaswaram, because these are all improvised) that again HAVE to end at the prescribed point in the rhythm cycle and approach the note where they continue the song again in a manner consistent with the raagam. In other words, in the Charanam, the sangadis yield to the Kalpanaswaram.

In contemporary concerts, when the Ragam-Tanam-Pallavi is performed, there is a space given for 'Tani aavartanam' or solo performances by the accompanying instrumentalists.

The ability to sing controlled murkis or gamakams, controlled both by raga and by taalam, is a key measure of ability in Carnatic music.

This is a very conversational intro written by someone whose learning is through osmosis and so likely to be faulty.

Some online resources prepared by experts:

http://www.carnatica.net/

http://www.indianetzone.com/2/carnatic_music.htm

http://www.rhythmnraga.org/carnaticmusic2.html

If you want to listen to good Carnatic music, try starting with something like
this album by Bombay Jayashree http://www.musicindiaonline.com/music/carnatic_vocal/s/album .6188/
or
this concert album by Aruna Sayeeram
http://www.musicindiaonline.com/music/carnatic_vocal/s/album .2307/artist.110/

I hope this helps and I hope if there are mistakes, someone corrects them.

Thanks for the explanation!

Oh I love Antakshari! I started watching the Star One one recently and was surprised with how strict they are with the technicalities, even with the younger kids! I was expecting full points for singing the lyrics correctly but they mention when someone misses an alaap and what not!

So each repetitive line of the Pallavi and Anupallavi sound different cos of the increasing murkis. Does increasing mean increasing in volume? The words are the same but the increasing changes in the murkis or gamakams make it stand out from the same sung earlier? Interesting! DoesTaalam=Taal=Beat?

I'll check the links for more information, thanks.

Article on Bhoopali, Deshkar and Mohanam:

http://www.sawf.org/newedit/edit08052002/musicarts.asp

Sayonara from Love in Tokyo is raag Deshkar. Who should sing it? Mirande? Priyani?