Why didn't Arjun protect Draupadi? - Page 15

Originally posted by: HearMeRoar

Not quoting the whole long thing.

The numbers are NOT the same as the numbers for your points.

1. Panchali freed them. She didn't forgive them. She was also very clear she was doing it for Prativindhya, not Yudhishtira. In fact, she ripped into Yudhishtira after the dice hall. She also later said to Bheema women married to Yudhishtira will be miserable. She also called Yudhishtira a mad man who should've been locked up - this was after war.

2. Yudhishtira was no cool customer. He sent a message to Panchali to ask her to come with her "navel exposed" and cry to the king for mercy. She did the exact opposite.

3. Arjuna's words mattered. One, because he didn't speak until then as he was not clairvoyant to know what the enemy would do. When he saw it, he spoke up. Two, Duryodhana offered to free her if any of the younger Pandavas supported her claim to be a free woman. That's when Arjuna spoke. So yes, it mattered very much.

4. It wasn't Panchali's trauma alone? Oh, yes, it was. Yes, yes, absolutely yes. Just like if Panchali got into a car accident and broke her leg it would be she in pain and no one else, SHE got assaulted. Pandavas might have been humiliated, but SHE was the one who underwent the assault. To appropriate her pain for the Pandavas is to minimize sexual assault.

5. Arjuna does explode at Yudhishtira in Karna Parva with accusations of sitting on Panchali's bed and doing nothing while the rest of his family fought the war.

6. And yes, Krishna does blame Yudhishtira. Right before the mace fight between Bheema and Duryodhana, Krishna finally loses his cool and says with a brother like Yudhishtira, all of them were slated to wander in the wilderness.

Can you quote no 5 and 6 please 😆

Originally posted by: CaptainSpark

Can you quote no 5 and 6 please 😆

"'Arjuna said, "Do thou not, O king, address these upbraidings to me, thou that art passing thy time full two miles away from battle.

...

Thou, O Bharata, art strong in words and very unfeeling. Thou thinkest me to be like thyself. I always strive to do thee good with my soul, life, sons and wives. Since, not withstanding all this, thou still piercest me with such wordy darts, it is evident that we cannot expect any happiness from thee. Lying on Draupadi's bed thou insultest me, though for thy sake I slay the mightiest of car-warriors.

..."

https://www.sacred-texts.com/hin/m08/m08070.htm

Vasudeva, filled with wrath, said these words unto Yudhishthira, "What rash words hast thou spoken, O king, to the effect, 'Slaying one amongst us be thou king among the Kurus.'

...

Vasudeva, filled with wrath, said these words unto Yudhishthira, "What rash words hast thou spoken, O king, to the effect, 'Slaying one amongst us be thou king among the Kurus.'

...

Thou hast placed thine own self, however, in a position of difficulty. We have, in consequence of this, been placed in great danger!

...

How couldst thou say unto him, 'Slaying only one amongst us be thou king'? Without a doubt, the offspring of Pandu and Kunti are not destined to enjoy sovereignty! They were born for passing their lives in continued exile in the woods or in mendicancy!"

https://www.sacred-texts.com/hin/m09/m09033.htm

Originally posted by: naq5

@bold how fit was yudhishthir to be a king according to this then. was it just because he was elder? wasnt it supposed to be the one who was most fit to be on the throne

Have wondered this myself for so long. Why was he considered dharma raj when he was anything but in many critical/crucial aspects/events.

By the end, no one was left I guess from royalty & they were used to deferring to Yudi. Plus he was the king/leader of the winning side.

Originally posted by: naq5

@bold how fit was yudhishthir to be a king according to this then. was it just because he was elder? wasnt it supposed to be the one who was most fit to be on the throne

Well the alternative was Duryodhana😆

Originally posted by: HearMeRoar

Well the alternative was Duryodhana😆

Why not Arjun?? Or even Sahdev?

I sometimes feel Janamejay/Parikshit requested and got VedVyas ji add the chapter on Yaksha Prashna to somehow prove that he was the best and most balanced in the lot

Originally posted by: HearMeRoar

Well the alternative was Duryodhana😆

why not someone else bheem or arjun or someone else from the kauravas like vikarna

yudi anyway rested on the laurels of arjun & bheem

Originally posted by: HearMeRoar

"'Arjuna said, "Do thou not, O king, address these upbraidings to me, thou that art passing thy time full two miles away from battle.

...

Thou, O Bharata, art strong in words and very unfeeling. Thou thinkest me to be like thyself. I always strive to do thee good with my soul, life, sons and wives. Since, not withstanding all this, thou still piercest me with such wordy darts, it is evident that we cannot expect any happiness from thee. Lying on Draupadi's bed thou insultest me, though for thy sake I slay the mightiest of car-warriors.

..."

https://www.sacred-texts.com/hin/m08/m08070.htm

Vasudeva, filled with wrath, said these words unto Yudhishthira, "What rash words hast thou spoken, O king, to the effect, 'Slaying one amongst us be thou king among the Kurus.'

...

Vasudeva, filled with wrath, said these words unto Yudhishthira, "What rash words hast thou spoken, O king, to the effect, 'Slaying one amongst us be thou king among the Kurus.'

...

Thou hast placed thine own self, however, in a position of difficulty. We have, in consequence of this, been placed in great danger!

...

How couldst thou say unto him, 'Slaying only one amongst us be thou king'? Without a doubt, the offspring of Pandu and Kunti are not destined to enjoy sovereignty! They were born for passing their lives in continued exile in the woods or in mendicancy!"

https://www.sacred-texts.com/hin/m09/m09033.htm

and why was krishna so angry with yudhisthir?

Originally posted by: HearMeRoar

Well the alternative was Duryodhana😆

If it was merit first why not any of the other brothers.

This is why I have always wondered how it is merit first when the fight is between two ELDER brothers of both lot.

Originally posted by: Eloquent

Have wondered this myself for so long. Why was he considered dharma raj when he was anything but in many critical/crucial aspects/events.

By the end, no one was left I guess from royalty & they were used to deferring to Yudi. Plus he was the king/leader of the winning side.

I have come to a conclusion that Dharmaraj was someone who knew the rules and constitution by heart, Right to education is a recent thing back then every student picked their favorite subject like Arjuna had knowledge of weapons, similarly Yudi studied law like Judges and Law students but the difference is that our constitution is a lawyer's Paradise, flexible where one can find loopholes back then there was no loophole for slaves, however wrong Yudi followed rules of his time

Originally posted by: naq5

and why was krishna so angry with yudhisthir?

Because Yudi the great promised Dury boy that he can pick any pandava and a weapon, either he defeats any of them he wins the war or Krishna was afraid he will choose Yudi and defeat him and with King's death, Duryodhan will win the war