If you believe in God, refute this! - Page 77

Originally posted by: Freethinker112

It's the debate of origin, we can never relax unless we know. 😉

Originally posted by: Freethinker112

Won't you be, if you suddenly lost your memory and didn't know anything about how you came here? 😆

Originally posted by: Freethinker112

Please try to understand what I say before replying. You have been doing this repeatedly.

Electron seems pointlike from the scales we can see. That does not mean it has to be a point particles. That assumption is made to simplify the calculations. For example, can you see an atom with your eye? So, does that mean it is 0 dimensions? No, as technology developed, we were able to look on small scales. Same thing is being done but electron is very very small. Whatever radius it may have will be less than 10^-18 m.

Who said black holes don't have volume? They do. The proposed singularity doesn't, which is just our model breaking down and failing to explain what exactly is there. I will again say, read before you post.

Originally posted by: Freethinker112

@ Angie and Birdie's posts regarding brain activity

I have read about that experiment before and it is quite interesting. It may mean that consciousness is the product of brain i.e. matter. A "screen" or "display output" where we see, read what has brain decided. The subconscious part of the brain is really a matter of interest. It is possible that the brain decides what to do. But shouldn't we then "know" instead of thinking consciously? And how does subconscious make decision? It has to be from all the information we receive throughout the life. Can it be something like reflex action? Like when touching something hot, spinal cord sends the signal for quick reaction rather than going all the way to brain. What if unconscious is the "fast" part? It meddles through all the data and makes a decision. And that is then output to consciousness. Like when we want to remember something. We don't go looking through neurons, do we? We just want to remember and the memories are there. Maybe this retrieving is done by sub conscious?

Originally posted by: Freethinker112

Please try to understand what I say before replying. You have been doing this repeatedly.

Electron seems pointlike from the scales we can see. That does not mean it has to be a point particles. That assumption is made to simplify the calculations. For example, can you see an atom with your eye? So, does that mean it is 0 dimensions? No, as technology developed, we were able to look on small scales. Same thing is being done but electron is very very small. Whatever radius it may have will be less than 10^-18 m.

Who said black holes don't have volume? They do. The proposed singularity doesn't, which is just our model breaking down and failing to explain what exactly is there. I will again say, read before you post. <<<<< Zero is always considered as a number so low that the objects existing at that size / shape / dimensions can't be seen ...It doesn't necessarily be exact noting ..But its so low that its always beyond interpretation ..Assumption for the sake of convenience Hahaha ..True that ..Convenience in reaching answers that are just as assumptive and sometime even untrue ..That's what the math is all about ..But Math or it's practitioners don't offer such privilege to other branches of knowledge ..Which is sad ... Who said black holes have no volume? I say so basing my judgement on a criteria : Black holes have INFINITE DENSITY and using a popular math equation which states Density = Mass / Volume ..Everyone knows that Mass is always finite ..So what makes a black hole have INFINITE density ? of course the ZERO Volume ..<<<<< Now who is wrong here ? The Math equation or the Physics that states Black Holes have infinite Density ? Sir ? 😆

Read before posting : Fairy nuff ! But are you telling me this ? Or asking yourself that ? 😆 Cause all I can see is that you have hastily omitted the important words like NON ROTATING <<< in this case ..Where a Non Rotating Star collapses and becomes a black hole ..

I so wish IF had a VOICE facility too ..So that I can read out my posts to you with a proper emphasize on the important words that you usually overlook ...😆

Who said black holes have zero mass? 😕 <<< That was a typo error which you shoulda noticed had ya read what I wrote before ...Its ZERO VOLUME ..The Mass is always there but finite ..The Space Volume though is ZERO evading the singularity as science assumes ..

I don't think a dead body would move for 15 minutes and if it did there will be a biological explanation. You can ask a doctor, I am not a medical expert. << Ask a slaughterer ( How the slaughtered lamb moves even minutes after they behead them ) then if you don't trust me I have seen such a body ..Or would you like to Behead me and test that ? 😆 Well I ain't a doctor either ..and you too are still studying as per one of your earlier posts ..So We should either consider ourselves not eligible to debate on a subject as complex as the God and The Souls or ready ourselves to fetch every bit of available knowledge of information from every possible source...Not just physics / Math. There will be a biological explanation ..So please google that or ask a medical practitioner cause I had presented the question to you ..And my only point was the resultant body movement is not a effect of signals generated by the brain which is cut off or the spinal chord.

No, but we do have a cloud where we can say it exists. If it resides in electrons, everything has electrons. So, does my computer has soul? And electricity is what, running souls? <<< Position in a cloud is assumptive again ..Its not the exact position ..its a probability ..Does your computer have a SOUL ? No ..Cause if it had that if woulda become Vital ...A SOUL doesn't enter random electrons or the random objects that are made of electrons . They are absorbed in a body suitable to feel Emotions ..Pain , Joy , Glumness ..All objects are made of Electrons but their properties and behaviors are different ...

No, it is pointlike. And there are many properties of a particle. Not just charge, there is mass, dipole moment, spin, etc. We don't know how exactly is the thought produces and exactly what it is. And where did I say that thoughts don't exist? That's something we experience so we know it is there but can't explain it now. That is different from both not being able to observe and not having any explanation. << Correct ..You know the thoughts exist ..But you don't know their properties or location ..As per you say that's something you experience ..In the same way a person who observes the death understands that the vitality is lost and unless you define what vitality is or what creates consciousness I would continue to call that the SOUL .. Its a name given to something that causes the death ...and vitality to be lost ..The spirituality must be given a consideration to reach a amicable solution ..My earlier example of a headless body moving is also observation .with no agreeable explanation that the science can give me ..

That is all the function of brain and memory. People lose memory an don't know who they are. Does that mean they lost their soul? Everything is controlled by brain, there is no supernatural going on here. <<<<<< My point was not about Remembering one's name and address 😆 It was about having at least little consciousness to reckon oneself as ME ..A Nameless me ...The death is when one stops knowing that its HIM or a HER or Whatever 😆 The moment one stops knowing their existence .with or without a name or identity clinging to that is the moment when the brain is dead which is a Medically approved criteria defining DEATH ...When both Conscious and Subconscious minds stop reckoning their existence .. the death occurs 😛

I have answered all of them. Please read my reply before you post and check your facts before you post. It's tiring to correct you repeatedly and then you write the same thing again.

I already said electron are very stable. There mean half life is in the order of 10^26 years. Electrons are annihilated only with positron. If that is avoided, they won't become photon. They may decay but as I said already their half life is very very long. The electron is in atom in cell in tissue in organs. The body decays and the organic matter is converted to other forms. That's basic knowledge. When body is burnt, it's similar to burning of organic matter. CO2, smoke, heat etc. is released. Why won't the decay? Decaying is just changing the form, it does not mean that electrons are being destroyed.

So, you see, I have already answered everything if you bother to read. And please read up on facts before posting. Electrons are the lightest of all particles and energy conservation is not possible until they decay if they ever decay into a particle lighter than them ...NO FREETHINKA... Electrons never decay ...And the body is made of electrons ..You lower the scale of observation when it comes to reckoning dimensions and even call visually 2D objects as 3D objects after breaking them down to Electron Level ...And again as it comes to the Decay process which can not happen in the case of electrons you scale upwards and discuss tissues as a object ..Everything is made of Electrons ..even the tissues so they MUST NOT DECAY ..or SHRINK ..If the matter is converted into forms ..tell me what matter the electrons get converted to as they Decay ..If the LAW that states that the energy can't be destroyed in true ...

This is insane 😆 ...I mean without adding spirituality which is no Magic ...Its a definite science ..Finding a GOD or the SOUL or refuting their existence with the help of math formulas that are utterly assumptive in nature would be like Running around like a Chicken With it's Head Chopped Off 😆 ..My contention is Refute the phenomena that everyone knows of using scientific formulas in a agreeable way ..Without saying there are a few / many things that you can't know or explain as an answer ...Or accept the existence of the unknown and let people call that The GOD

Hic !!

Vintu 😛

Ps. In case if you fell to observe that I and question me I must clarify first that my Current / Most Recent comments are in BLUE ..The ones from the previous post are in RED and yours are in black ...

Originally posted by: BirdieNumNum

black holes and such are just mathematical toys, as is spacetime and time travel and the rest of the science fiction we've been using. IMO Our understanding of these phenomena is currently limited to our ability to model them mathematically, much like we model weather phenomena using forecasting models which are often wrong. Physics is about particles, their properties and their interactions, much as one might want to believe physics is math. I think even general relativity theory is a math trick, unless you believe space is really curved. In other words, we still dont have an understanding of the phenomena called gravity even though we can use the math equations to predict it. So let's not suggest that just because we have some math (which we pass off as physics) that we really understand many of the physical phenomena. And historically speaking, nearly all scientific theories have originated from what people once considered as myths. But let's face it- what we have today is a lot of math that is empirically verifiable or testable, so we accept it as scientifically proved, even when they dont have any counterpart in nature. Conversely, just because something is not currently verifiable does not make it false. If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck and quacks like a duck, it just might be a duck, even though we might not be able to experimentally prove it. Like others have said before, if we are looking for scientific proofs, i dont think we'll get there. So why not come up with our own theories. If folks had dismissed previous myths as "blind speculations", we would have never gotten to the math models we have today, incomplete or unsatisfactory as these might be in REALLY explaining various phenomena.

Originally posted by: BirdieNumNum

oh but you could. You could always stop with the "blind" mischaracterizations. 😆I think i only asked a question here, but did you somehow manage to find "blind speculations" and "untestable hypothesis" even in the mere asking? 😆

Originally posted by: _Angie_

...and till you know you could always speculate.
How about trying to enumerate some of the speculations so far and try finding out if at all and how they change the present situation in anyway. That should atleast give some idea of where we could be headed.

Originally posted by: _Angie_

I guess the person would be more worried about where he would go rather than how he came to be there. If its a person with faith he may even trust his loved ones to trace him and take him back home. If they dont then it may not be worth going back in any case so why the desperation?

If its a person without faith, yeah, he has serious cause to get desperate 😆

Originally posted by: BirdieNumNum

and what is the dimension of whatever makes up the electron? Might be an infinite regress problem.

perhaps we all need to read more before we post. But then no one would be posting.😆