Tandav is not a Dance Form! - Page 2

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redeye2012 thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#11

Originally posted by: Samanalyse


Nope, you nailed it with these bits of your response. These are exactly my problems with the dance, compounded considerably by the fact that the judges didn't have a clue. I have never given Madhuri much credit for knowing anything about dance (I remember a while back during the first or second season of KBC she was a star contestant and she actually froze on the question who is Nataraja? The options were four variations on "god of ___." She actually used 50/50! 😲 I remember this all too clearly). She just dances, and in her case that is more than enough because she is so gosh darn good at it naturally, but not when she is a judge and the supposed classically trained on at that. And I certainly expected more knowledge from Remo!

And you were spot on about this being some sort of warrior dance, which is simply mistaking the meaning of the word tandav. Tandav, if it is angry, is not a dance that is fighting for something. It is a dance of fury that there is nothing to fight for.

I loved your idea of making it a duet by including Shakti more clearly. But that would have implied having a concept, god forbid.

Mostly, I am mad at the makers of the show ideologically because they are disrespecting the culture and definitions of certain art forms, trying to generalise and seem diverse in the process. I am so disappointed by that attitude!


Bold: I am sorry for yelling but...YOU'VE GOT TO BE KIDDING ME!!! 🀣...Was it the first question she was asked as a contestant? So she froze, but I hope she had the grace to look embarrassed after her response? Lord Nataraja! Help!

Her comments are so 'unexpert-like'. Her judgement is more like a 'feel good' sort of response. If she enjoyed it for whatever reason, it was a great dance. If she didn't, it was not. πŸ˜•

And what's this obsession with lifts? The audience on the sets too seems to go bonkers every time there's a lift. I guess, that's another reason for including them willy-nilly in the acts.

I think it was DID, where one episode was all about classical dance. And they had Sonal Mansingh as a guest judge. I think JDJ can borrow this idea and restrict Indian classical forms to one episode and even if they don't bring someone of Sonal's stature (who would no doubt be screaming inside or turning violent watching a Sanath or a Susheel), they could bring someone who knows the intricacies. In one episode of DID, Geeta Kapoor choreographed a Mohini attam piece based on Indian mythology - Mohini (Vishnu)'s competition with Bhasmasura. In the choreography, Mohini vanquishes Bhasmasura and is then shown folding her hands and bowing before Lord Vishnu!😲 Sonal Mansingh immediately caught it and schooled Geeta on it. It was so embarrassing for Geeta even though she gracefully accepted her error.

I just mentioned the above example because I too am offended when they corrupt and abuse the ancient art forms in this fashion without getting fully apprised of the context. In another piece, one contestant danced Bharatnatyam to a funky music piece. While I have nothing against dance fusion, the result in this instance was horrendous in that it made no sense first of all, and second of all, the funky music was fast, the dancer couldn't complete her steps in time. I was going- Did anyone hold a gun to your head to do this?

Anyway, it is a pity that with the kind of reach these shows have, what they are resorting to in the name of entertainment.
Edited by redeye2012 - 12 years ago
stylish_VJ thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#12

Originally posted by: Samanalyse

Richa! πŸ˜ƒ

Does nobody even watch DKDMD from JDJ PH? They showed it pretty well there!




Agree completely😊
Samanalyse thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#13
@pippa: My issue here is not really with the dance itself but the idea that the makers, on such a large platform, can get away with knowing absolutely nothing and then transmitting their ignorance to the masses. If the dance had been dubbed Bharatanatyam, I would have cringed, no doubt but I would have accepted it as being no more butchery than the other dance forms. It is this idea of having the audacity to make up their own dance form that really gets to me! So it is more the ideological issue than any technical performance-related issue that is really bothering me. But I do agree completely that they are taking their viewers for a jolly ride and seem to expect everyone to hop on with a smile!

@Fantasy_K: You said it exactly. Tandav is not a dance form because nobody knows what it looked like. There are stories of Shiva doing tandav both out of joy and anger, they are two different occasions and reasons for that. And you are right. It is not "true" in the conventional sense, because it is a mythological concept, completely open to interpretation and it has been interpreted differently by vastly different dance forms, from classical to contemporary. I once saw a tandav interpretation where the dancer showing Shiva leapt around the stage, miming Shiva, playing with the planets and stars before he placed them in the universe! It was phenomenal because it put a modern twist on an ancient concept of creation and destruction. Essentially that is the theme that tandav demonstrates - creation and destruction, not war as the performers tried to show!

@Red: Yes, yes and more YES! There should be a better knowledge and classification of dance forms and certainly judges who are capable of accurately judging them. That Mohini-Bhasmasura story is quite horrifying! πŸ˜²πŸ˜† But I am so glad Sonalji was there to correct it. We need so much more of this mixing of classical artists on to these mainstream stages. The problem is that mainstream entertainment producers consider classical dance as "boring" because they haven't a clue and classical dancers see participation in these shows as selling out or lowering your "purity," because they too are a pretentious lot of snobs. Until this apartheid is bridged, classical dancing will remain closeted and exclusive and mainstream producers will continue to take advantage of general ignorance. *SIGH*

PS: The MD/KBC story is all too true. You never forget the moment when your idol falls from grace. 😭

stylish_VJ thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#14
First of all Sammy...Amazing Post...Kudos to thatπŸ‘

Here is my 2 cents...Hope it makes senseπŸ˜‰


Performers and their Performance: As far as i know there are many forms of Tandav...And after seeing Jayati Ji's act, i wanna say that they were attempting to do a Rudra Tandav, considering the fact that all her expressions were hinting to the same, the power they infused in the act also talks volumes of how they were aiming at performing "Rudra Tandav"...But unfortunately her act was not pure Tandav...

Sammy i am sure you know about "Bhar
at's Natya Shastra" which says

"Pum nrityam Tandavam Prahu.
Sthree nrityam lasya muchiyathe"

This is
a Sanskrit verse (The above is not written in Sanskrit format Just plain English) which translates that the Tandava is mainly associated with Lord Shiva...and for the female, that is the feminine part as in response to Shiva's Tandav is "Lasya" (A more feminine version)...

This necessarily does not mean that only males can do Tandav and Lasya is confined to females...But since it was a team act, they could have very well incorporated this...But the still saddening part of the act was that there was no concept, there was no story-telling whatsoever...As much as i believe it should have been "ASH" that were to be used, the usage of "KUMKUM" i believe was to depict anger...Red always represents Anger...Though technically and conceptually wrong...i am forced to believe it this way.

Coming to the expressions, lets assume that they were doing "Rudra Tandav" does that necessarily mean there should be no change in expressions...Why the anger? What's the reason that lead to the "Rudra Tandav" citing a very few basic ones like grief, pain etc would have enhanced what little they were trying to do...Atleast in the expressions dept.

The major fault here lies with the person/team whoever it was that gave Jayati and Diwakar the dance form... Just plain Tandav gave room for them to add many things, which def leaves a sour taste in the eyes of classically trained dancers, and also even non-dancers who may have little knowledge of "TANDAV"...

With all due respect, Remo is very week in Classical department and i never expect him to point out any technical aspects of this form. I expected Madhuri to say something in this context, considering that she is a classical dancer but it was very disappointing from her part too...

I guess i covered the act pretty much...But i really applaud Jayati Ji for her effort and hardwork.πŸ‘

redeye2012 thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#15
@Sam...

It is lack of will and paucity of creativity. A competitive format can certainly be developed that is educative where they have some experts point out nuances of a classical form combined with a competition.

True, not everything can be taught, but at attempt can be made.

About classical dancers staying away... Just imagine after the Mohini-Bhasmasura piece, Karan goes...that was sexy...so sexy! Pretentious or not, I would highly recommend staying away...😊
Rolzz thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#16
Wow..Thanks for sharing this with us!!
\
Its sad the judges know A to Z about all western dance forms but not indian classical :(
naureenfizz thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#17
I don't have much info about dance!! But I am quite shock to hear that Tandav is not a Dance form!! Judges should point out these basics things to the contestant
Edited by sweetrahz - 12 years ago
rajla thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#18
Very informative post...Thankyou for sharing
maddy311 thumbnail
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Posted: 12 years ago
#19
This was an eye opener post for me. I didn't know about tandav and its culture. Thanks for sharing this valuable info.
Must say judges are ignorant about indian dance and obsessed with western dance but I am pretty sure this is not the first time as I have seen it in past in another reality show... i don't remember exactly but may be it was nach baliye
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