Where is Barbareek mentioned - Page 2

Yes Skanda Purana is Shakta text though people classify it as Shaiva.

You can notice the rivalry between Shaiva Shakta and Vaishnava here. Since Arjun and Krishna are Nara Narayana as per Vaishnava to get one up on them Draupadi becomes Kali and Krishna her weapon. And Barbareek her devotee becomes super invincible.

By the way Barbareek did exist and definetly did not participate in the war.

Ghatothkach is given three sons from two wives. Barbareek is supposed be son of Mauravi, Narkasur's brother and commander Mura's daughter. This marriage was done by Krishna. Yudhistir was apparently against it as he wanted a non rakshasi princess for Ghato. But Bhima convinced him.

He is also married to a Dasarna Yadava princess Ahilawati arranged through Dhristadyumn or Draupadi most likely as Dasarna was Shikhandi and his sasural and had two sons Anjanaparva and Meghavarna .Now many people presume Maurvi was Ahilawati but I dont think so. These stories are part of south indian folklores.

Barbareek may not have participated in the war along with Meghavarna if they were very young. Anjanaparva may have been the oldest

I had read about Meghavarna going with Arjun on Ashwamedha after the war...Again in Skandapurana. Wish we could confirm it in Jaimini MB

The more I read these tribal stories the more I believe Hidimba and Ghatothkach were not abandoned by Bhima. They were very much part of the family. Even if they were not present in HP all the time. Pandavas seem to be present in their lives at inportant times.

And about Ghato' son being in war. Do note that Ghato was born a year after Lakshagriha. while Abhimanyu was born much later. It does seem that Ghato had his first son around the same time Abhimanyu was born. (Draupadi marriage and IP building 10 years Arjun's exile 12 years makes him 22 when Abhi was born.)

Originally posted by: Chiillii

Yes Skanda Purana is Shakta text though people classify it as Shaiva.

You can notice the rivalry between Shaiva Shakta and Vaishnava here. Since Arjun and Krishna are Nara Narayana as per Vaishnava to get one up on them Draupadi becomes Kali and Krishna her weapon. And Barbareek her devotee becomes super invincible.

By the way Barbareek did exist and definetly did not participate in the war.

Ghatothkach is given three sons from two wives. Barbareek is supposed be son of Mauravi, Narkasur's brother and commander Mura's daughter. This marriage was done by Krishna. Yudhistir was apparently against it as he wanted a non rakshasi princess for Ghato. But Bhima convinced him.

He is also married to a Dasarna Yadava princess Ahilawati arranged through Dhristadyumn or Draupadi most likely as Dasarna was Shikhandi and his sasural and had two sons Anjanaparva and Meghavarna .Now many people presume Maurvi was Ahilawati but I dont think so. These stories are part of south indian folklores.

Barbareek may not have participated in the war along with Meghavarna if they were very young. Anjanaparva may have been the oldest

I had read about Meghavarna going with Arjun on Ashwamedha after the war...Again in Skandapurana. Wish we could confirm it in Jaimini MB

The more I read these tribal stories the more I believe Hidimba and Ghatothkach were not abandoned by Bhima. They were very much part of the family. Even if they were not present in HP all the time. Pandavas seem to be present in their lives at inportant times.

And about Ghato' son being in war. Do note that Ghato was born a year after Lakshagriha. while Abhimanyu was born much later. It does seem that Ghato had his first son around the same time Abhimanyu was born. (Draupadi marriage and IP building 10 years Arjun's exile 12 years makes him 22 when Abhi was born.)

Thankyou for the detailed response. But if Barbareek is only mentioned in Skanda Puran then can we believe it to be true?? We all know Puranas are mostly stories not Itihaas.

Then we get the age conflict again

If Ghato was even 17 when Abhimanyu was born(only 5 years in IP) and Bheem was 17 at Ghato birth, then at the time of the war, Bheem is 50 at the time of the war (considering Abhimanyu 16) Yudhishtir becomes 51, Since Pandu had sons late, so he would have been at least 18 when Yudhishtir was born, so Dhritrashtra (being equal in age to Pandu) was 69 at the time of the war. Vichitraveer ji married and died after his wives went for Niyog, considering he married at 16 and immidiately died, after a year of which Pandu n Dhritrashtra was born, he was born 69+17=86 years prior to the war. Kripacharya n Kripi were already there when Vichitraveer ji was born, so Kripacharya is at least 86. Devrat was at least a teenager when Shantanu married Satyavati. Then they had Chitrangad, and then Vichitraveer. So Devrat is at least 17 years elder to Vichitraveer ji, i.e born at least103 years prior to the war

So are we using the assumption that people of 86-105 years were riding the Chariots and fighting the war?

Ignore Bhishma for a while.

Three things have to be considered as unchangeable

1. Women were not married before 16. And men in default used to be older than women.

2. Men completed their education between 16 to 19. 10 yrs for snatak was common for everyone. Few would extend higher education with same guru or a different one for becoming snatakottar

So Rama did Snatak with Vashishta and snatakottar with vishwamitra. Bhima and Dury did snatak with Drona but snatakottar with Balram. Sahadev did snatakottar with Brihaspati.

But not every one did that, for eg Arjun did not.

3. Men had to remain brahmachari while pursuing education. They cannot marry before 16 therefore.

So earliest a man could marry was between 17 - 20

We can presume

VV married at 17

Pandu married at 19

Arjun married at 19 (which means Yudhistir must be 23 when he married Draupadi and Bhima 21, twins can be 18 or 19). Ghato was born a couple of months earlier.

It would take atleast 5 years to build a city and towns with a booming economy and magnificient fort and palace and fruit gardens that are described for a barren IP when Narada arrives with his exile rule. So when Arjun returns from exile with pregnant subhadra, Ghato has to be minimum 5+12= 17. He could have a pregnant wife too

And Arjun 19+17=36. A few months later Abhi is born along with Ghato's son

It should take atleast 3 years for khandavdahn and Maya palace and Rajasuya is a 12 month ritual. I just checked shatapata brahman. 4 years before dice game and 13 years after it.

So at the time of war

Abhimanyu is 16. Ghatothkach son is also 16.

Ghato is however 17+16=33.

Arjun is 36+16=52. Yudhistir 56. Bhima 54.

If Pandu had been alive he would be at the minimum 24 + 56 = 80

Coming to Drona, he was contemporary of Pandu and Drupad. He can be 85 now can he not.

Now does this reconcile the text where Abhi is 16 at the time of war and Drona 85.

Let us come to Bhishma and Kripa kripi now. Ignore what is in the texts. It seems completely illogical for an ordinary fisherman to ask king to bequeath his kingdom to get a bride. Kings just kidnapped the brides. Remember Bhishma kidnapping kashi sisters. It is equally illogical for bhishma to bequeath thrones to satyavati's sons. What if she miscarries. What if she has only daughters. How could anyone predict at that point Satyavati would have sons.

One more thing. A king cannot remain a bachelor. He has to officiate the ceremonies in the kingdom and he cannot do that without a wife.

So Santanu married Satyavati as soon as gabga left and within a year Chitrangad and in two more years vichitravirya was born.

When Bhishma returned after 16 years, Satyavati walked out with her teenage sons to her dad's palce. That is when Dasraj refuses to send them back unless Bhishma abdicates.

Similarly it can be Bhishma who adopts Kripa Kripi on behalf of his father as he cannot because of his oath. And Vichitravirya is dead too. In any case Kripa is ruled out for throne as it is already bequeathed to Satyavati's sons. That could also be one reason she calls Vyasa fpr Niyoga. To prevent brahmin born but adopted in name of Kshatirya Santanu, Kripa from getting the throne

Then Bhishma who is atmost 3 years older than VV becomes 20+80= 100 years old. Kripa/Kripi can be 80.

That would reconcile the ages.

Yes 100 looks too much. But for someone who has had a good food and exercised well regularly and not smoked or drunk it is possible.