THE THINKERS’’..TOPIC 1. - Page 4

Of treating daughters as sons or vice versa...

First of all, thank you all for saying such sweet things about the lynn-and-me picture. i figured it couldnt hurt...especially coz these days i am barely participating...LOL

On the issue of saying "i have sons, not daughters, etc." i agree with the points raised by both xyzzee and chukkna. The problem therein lies with the perceptions that each of us have of the masculine and feminine roles in the society at the macro level and in the household at the micro level. To some of us, being called "a boy" is offensive because we associate being a girl to being fundamentally equal. To some of us, being called "a boy" is complimentary because we associate being a girl to being treated as an inferior by the society.
If i ever ever decided to have kids, i would want both a girl and a boy because having grown up with a male sibling has been an amazing experience for both of us (bro and me). We have established a deeper understanding and appreciation for the opposite gender and also been able to identify the weaknesses of the opposite gender and treat them accordingly. I am sure that those of you have male siblings (or female siblings if you are male) can relate to this to some extent.

According to psychology, young girls idolize their fathers and young boys idolize their mothers. *unfortunately some boys never grow up!* 😆 If they have male and female siblings respectively, they are likely to see a whole new persona thereby preparing themselves for the variety in people when they become adults.

Being treated as an equal by parents often defines the behavior of a child when she/he reaches adulthood in general. This issue doesnt only include female versus male children but also extends to the so-called "underachieving siblings."

All-in-all, being called "the weaker sex" is such an irony - because it has been proven in the biological research and literature that women live longer, have pain thresholds that are almost twice those of men, are less likely to face terminal diseases, have marginally stronger hearts and other vulnerable body organs, are more likely to bounce back from major disruptions or losses in their personal lives, and a larger brain for the size of their skulls!! Of course this is all based on averages, still...

"There is a difference between being merely human and being a woman. The latter goes far beyond the capacity of humans" 😆

Well, bra-burning and no-shaving does not a feminist make - i guess we all agree that being feminine is an essential part of being a woman and that doesnt make our skills and potential any less than that of any man's! Amen to that!! 😃

The girl being paraya dhan and that the serials still play that card on the people is pathetic. If the fact that I am against this makes me a feminist, then that's fine.
I am only child to my parents. My parents do not expect that the son in law should come and live with them, and neither do I. But it is a given fact that I have two sets of parents to take care of and I do not have another person other than my husband to share that responsibility.
If only these serials stopped feeiding this crap to people, it would be nice.

Originally posted by: chukkna

XYZzee,

No parents treat their kids as different. That I can say withh 100 % confidence. We are 4 sisters and 1 brother and my mom was pressurised to have a boy by the family and society. Everyone looked at my Mom with sympathy, that poor girl has 4 daughters, how will she marry them and all the crap. My brother was youngest of all and we all pampered him. As a kid I used to think everyone loves him more cos he is a boy. But that was not the case. It was just because he was youngest of all.

Hi Rama, I agree and see your point as well! Thats' what I mean - my parents never treated my brother and me differently. They gave us both equal opportunities in all walks of life. That's why seeing these pariah crap in serials makes my blood boil. Even now my parents treat us as equals as I have mentined before - my husband is more like a son than a son-in-law. I also see why your father said what he did. But the serials depict a woman as inferior and hence being called a boy is considered great which I wholeheartedly detest.

I agree with Kruti that having a sibling of the opposite sex does give one a better understandings of their emotions - though I still think that depends on the person, the age difference, etc. My brother and I are quite far apart in age (he is much older) and though we share a bond, we did not share much of our thoughts and feelings with each other growing up. In many ways I grew up as an only child as did he. I guess my point is that just because my daughter is an only child - I dont expect her to be "emotionally incomplete". I have seen many girls amongst my own friends who have been the only children to their parents and have turned into mature, understanding, balanced adults. Having a sibling of the other sex helps - I agree, but that to me cannot be the only reason for having a second:-) The other factors (for me anyway) outweigh this one advantage too much (only in my case again, having two children may work for many others, just not for my hubby and me)!

Originally posted by: vazz

The girl being paraya dhan and that the serials still play that card on the people is pathetic. If the fact that I am against this makes me a feminist, then that's fine.
I am only child to my parents. My parents do not expect that the son in law should come and live with them, and neither do I. But it is a given fact that I have two sets of parents to take care of and I do not have another person other than my husband to share that responsibility.
If only these serials stopped feeiding this crap to people, it would be nice.

I agree with you Vazz! Another example of an only child who is "perfectly normal". And even if you did have someone to share the responsibilities with (like a brother) does not mean your share would have been less than his! I think I have mentioned that many times but if my brother were to move to Bangalore, my parents would insist they live in a different house - not in my parents' place. Like your parents, my parents do not expect my brother to come live with them, only difference it is a boy they are talking of here! Like Abhi's parents:-) I also know many parents who are this way these days - amongst my own cousins and friends, off the top of my head, I know at least 4! Nothing wrong staying in the same house but nothing wrong if they want to stay in a different house/flat either!

Originally posted by: xyzzee

Hi Rama, I agree and see your point as well! Thats' what I mean - my parents never treated my brother and me differently. They gave us both equal opportunities in all walks of life. That's why seeing these pariah crap in serials makes my blood boil. Even now my parents treat us as equals as I have mentined before - my husband is more like a son than a son-in-law. I also see why your father said what he did. But the serials depict a woman as inferior and hence being called a boy is considered great which I wholeheartedly detest.

I agree with Kruti that having a sibling of the opposite sex does give one a better understandings of their emotions - though I still think that depends on the person, the age difference, etc. My brother and I are quite far apart in age (he is much older) and though we share a bond, we did not share much of our thoughts and feelings with each other growing up. In many ways I grew up as an only child as did he. I guess my point is that just because my daughter is an only child - I dont expect her to be "emotionally incomplete". I have seen many girls amongst my own friends who have been the only children to their parents and have turned into mature, understanding, balanced adults. Having a sibling of the other sex helps - I agree, but that to me cannot be the only reason for having a second:-) The other factors (for me anyway) outweigh this one advantage too much (only in my case again, having two children may work for many others, just not for my hubby and me)!

I totally agree with you xyzzee...having one child doesnt mean that he/she is "emotionally incomplete" - i have many many friends (both male and female) who are single children and very well adjusted. I

You are also right about the age difference factor between siblings. If i had one child, i would prefer a female - emphasis on the word prefer - i would not mind having a male child. O well, this is such a moot point considering that i dont want children...😆.

Well, i gotta go for now...but i love this concept of having discussions on this forum...too bad II couldnt contribute much...he was the person who sent me a PM last week and asked me to check this out...😃

Originally posted by: krutilynn

😆 That was a good one!

Word Count: 0

Originally posted by: krutilynn

...too bad II couldnt contribute much...he was the person who sent me a PM last week and asked me to check this out...😃

....hmmmm, well he wouldn't have sent u one this week cos he'd've been to busy to...😉

but point taken,,,,,the night is still young and i really do wanna contribute, so will do my best to do so before the morrow...

Rama,Firstly I have to tell you how happy I felt to read your post.How wonderful that you could help your parents and siblings.I would have been proud too. 👏
I'm proud to know a person like you.

I think it's meant to be a compliment when one says about one's daughter" She is a son to me".It is not meant to belittle a girl child in any way.We cannot deny that for hundreds of years,the male child has been given more preference and previleges.In today's times,it is education that has made the diffrence.Daughters get equal opportunities to study and go out and earn an income.So when they carry out duties that were mainly assigned to the males in the family,one might make a statement"My daughter is like a son to me" but it would actually read "My son and daughter mean the same to me".Hats off to all those parents who think like that.

On having a male and female child....
I don't think any family is complete or incomplete by the presence or absence of a male/female child.The definition of complete is very relative,according to me.
I know of couples who have prefered to have kids of the same sex because they felt that the kids would have each other for company.Girls and Boys sometimes have very opposite interests and are hardly company for each other,although they love each other.This I can say from my own example.I got closer to my brother when we grew up.I would love to visit my cousins with whom I could play all the 'girlie' games.

In fact I want to raise another point here.A family is not even incomplete if there is only one child.Today's time demands more out of parents and with both working,or because of nuclear family system,a single child is a choice.The parents have to just make sure that they don't indulge him/her too much.They have to make that extra effort to ensure that the child does not become selfish and too dependant on them and vice versa.
Hvaing more than one child solves this by it self.One learns to share and care at home it self.The parents definitely have to take on that responsibilty if they want their only child to become a well adjusted and sociable individual.

Some couples even plan not to have kids.Even their family is not incomplete if that is what they want.The most important thing is to be happy.If they are at peace with their decision,they are a complete family by themselves.

Also lots of women themselves make statements like a woman is not complete without mother hood. I wonder where their feminism is that time.I totally disagree.Motherhood is not about giving birth to a baby.It is an emotional bond,the mostloving bond one can have with one's neice,nephew,friend's child,or even a neigbor's child. Sorry I went off track...could be another topic for next time.

My thoughts....

Cheers,
Akshata

HAVE YOU SENT IN YOUR TOPICS TO SREE FOR NEXT WEEK? PLEASE HURRY UP.

OK guys (or should I just say gals? 😳 )….nopes, Ill just say "Hello Ladies" 😃 …my sincere apologies for not replying earlier….just one those things, u know…I was going to write earlier in the week, but was having problems logging on…and then I also thought perhaps you guys (sorry, gals…sorry, ladies) might thing what is this tuppence he's put up! And then I got frightened… 😕.

I wont go into the definition of the word as it has already been defined so well…and all of it makes sense, so I just concur… 👏

(I think this has been said already...)
It's all very well saying that men and women are equal, but from what I can see, well, they just ain't. 😉 Not only are they worlds apart physically, but they are totally dissimilar mentally as well…it has been asked how often do women grope men? Ummm, well, I think we all know the answer, but it is also very true to say there are many women who look so simplistic and naive in the exterior, but who do tend to get their upper body very (and I mean very as in totally) close to a man and thereby get themselves felt. OK, peeps here may want to throw eggs at me for that comment, but it does happen, and each time it is surprising at who the lady is…so where basic human instincts are concerned, each and every one of us can be as guilty as the other….

Men don't give birth, but without them, it just can't be done.

Women get one opportunity a month to give birth, but man! that one opportunity can sometimes (so often) cause so many other problems!!! I am talking about PMS!!! Men don't get it, but they do suffer its effect! Although I am sure there is a male equivalent, it is certainly not as rife (yet anyway) in this age of irregular eating habits, and irregular living habits. (And also, lets not go into that one here). Can I ask you all a question please? If u don't mind? But why do women explode and display the full symptoms of PMS upon the mere mention of the word(s) PMS? Please, someone, enlighten me…. 🤢 😳 😃

You see, there are many many differences between the two sexes… the fact that one is a son and one a daughter is just to expose the obvious differences. If, in a family, a daughter is like a son, then that is OK. But will it be equally OK for the son to behave like a daughter? 😉

As far as I am concerned, it is perfectly alright for a woman to go to work and expect to be treated equally to a man. She should expect the same benefits, and there is no reason why she can't be as good, if not better, than the man at whatever it is she is doing. However, you have to bear in mind that many woman themselves choose to stay at home and look after the family (Thank GOD, cos the man would probably make a right dogs-dinner of it all!). And this decision on the woman's part should be equally respected. In fact, how many of the ladies here don't go to work, and that too out of choice? If it is a choice, then this is something that should also be respected.

You see, these things are based on personal choices, but as far as I am concerned, and according to my observances, I feel a woman has a role in the family and sometimes she has to accept it, like it or not, and make the best of it. Hope u guys don't mind, but once again, I shall refer to the raamacharitamaanaasa, in which a woman, Ansuyaji, tells Sitaji, another woman, that a woman should respect her husband even if he is old, dull-headed, sick, indigent, deaf, poor, wrathful or wretched….etc….despite all this, he should be respected.(I'm sorry, I am not able to reproduce the translation here, but I do have a jpeg of the translation if anyone wants it). Now, by all this, I don't mean a husband need be worshipped literally like GOD, and bowed down to umpteen times a day. No, he should be respected despite not wanting to. I have seen that when this doesn't happen, then the feminist woman who is a "mahila-mukti-morchaki-maha-mantri" will then go on to damage herself mentally. This is because, I feel, that woman needed to force themselves to respect their other half because if they don't then it is as if they loose out on a very necessary and integral part of their life and soul. i.e. her husband. A married woman needs him (certainly as per the Indian mentality). It's almost as if the dialogue between the 2 women that i mentioned is to actually protext the woman from herself!......I know there are extreme circumstances where this does not apply, but that is another topic. I am not saying the above applies 100% of the time. But the woman really should accept her husband, for her own sake. She should accept her husbands family as well and try to make the best of it. This, I feel, will lead to her leading a more happier and fulfilling life. I'm not sure I have explained myself very well in this paragraph, but please do try and understand what I am saying…it's just that I don't have the time to think and write more clearly, but thought I should contribute here. I will further say that I don't think it is something I can approve of for the man to go stay the the girls house. Abhi left his parents and went to stay at simran's. I didn't agree with that, but I can accept their were extenuating circumstances there.

Can I also say, that as a man, I also feel that quite often, the term "weaker sex" can more often than not, refer to us men. Ladies, we are totally lost without out woman. Really. It's no good without the woman. Really.

Peeps, I've gone on and on. Please do give me your comments, but please don't burn any bra's (cos I think men in fact really do want you to do that – you see, they have an ulterior motive!)…and please don't bite my head off. I don't know any of u personally, probably never will, so no offence is directed at any of you dear ladies. In general, I do agree with what most of u have written, perhaps more with srees and kruts postings…so any eggs sent my way should be targeted at them first. 😉

I know this was posted late, but please do reply if u can, even if another "Thinker's" thread has been started. Thanks peeps.

I agree with the points raised by Akshata! I gues about the daughters being like sons depends on interpetation but now in this day and age I would rather be happy being called a daughter, LOL!

Good points by ii, I agree marriage is about compromise, etc..and a woman needs to accept her husband as is, in Western Cultures they say "Until death shall do us apart"! But it has to work both ways - a man needs to accept his wife however she is..